Hi: My '57 Ford Tudor Ranch wagon had both front fenders replaced with NOS fenders in the distance past by a previous owner and the "Ranch Wagon" scripts were not reinstalled. I've removed the old paint and found no holes in either fender that would indicate the scripts ever existed (probably because the fenders were NOS). I've finally found a nice set of "Ranch Wagon" scripts that I want to mount on the fenders, but I can't do much until I can get some accurate measurements and coordinates so I make sure I get them positioned correctly on the fenders. I'm hoping that someone here can take measurements for me off their Tudor Ranch Wagon that I can use for this project. The measurements should be fairly easy to get using the vertical reveal between the rear of the fender and the front of the door, and the horizontal reveal at the top of the fender and the edge of the hood. The distance from these two points to the side and top of the "R" in "Ranch Wagon" should do the trick. And of course if anyone has an actual template I could use, that would be incredible. Thanks for any help I can get! Ron...
Maybe someone would make the effort to make a template and archive on this site.
OK...maybe I should make the effort. My scripts are off. I'll work on it.
Gasman--Much appreciated! Ron
I will try to get that for you tonight. Where did you find your scripts they are a little hard to locate? I found a set on ebay a while ago but they are not the best but I hope they will clean up
Ranch Wagon Script/Emblem Template
http://57fordsforever.com/smf/index.php?topic=5443.0
Gasman: Many thanks for the template, but now it looks like one of us has the wrong script. Your template, if I'm reading it right, shows 6 holes for studs, but my script has only 5 with no sign of one being broken off. For reference, my script is exactly 12" long from the widest points on each end; as to height, from the top to the bottom of the large "W" in "Wagon" is 1 and 5/16" ( 1 5/16"). Also of interest is when I put my script on your template, the two studs in the first letter "R" line up perfectly, but none of the others come close. And just so I'm on the same page as you, "belt line" to me means just below the window glass. Is that what you were indicating in your diagram? Sorry for the confusion on my end, but as you said, measure twice and drill once. Thanks, Ron...
Another example of nothing is absolute at the Ford Motor Company. I may have used the term beltline incorrectly. The line I referenced as beltline is the crease about 6-8" below the top of the fender. I have found that some badges require six holes and some use only five. The second pin on the 'W' seems to be optional. My original badges were damaged. One missing and the other broken with only 'Ranc' still on the fender. I have one badge and am still searching for another. Each model year has its own style of badge. The newer the model year the bigger/bolder the badge script style. Within a couple of model years the badge moved to the rear quarter. Without casting numbers, the one feature I look for is the size and the 'W' having pointed rockers (bottom of the letter). Newer versions have rounded rockers. I also have OEM Courier fenders. I noticed the similarity in badge location and pin pattern. I ran out of time to compare but I will in the near future. As mentioned before, at Ford, there are no rules. Look at all the different placements for mirrors and good luck if you're mounting spotlights. Making a template for the mirrors is on my list of to-dos. Just remember, these examples are an example of one car. This Ranch Wagon was built in San Diego plant.
Gasman: If you go to this website, you'll see a nice '57 Ford Tudor Ranch Wagon that sold at RM auctions in 2009 for $33k (it was out of the Nick Alexander Woodie collection). One of the pictures is the "Ranch Wagon" script you and I have been discussing and it's identical to the script I have. I'll be curious to hear back from you to see if your script also looks like this. Here's the link to the wagon:
http://www.rmauctions.com/lots/lot.cfm?lot_id=381920
Ron
May I muddy the waters here. The Ranch Wagon script in the link below has the same script I have on my RW and it is 12 inches long and block type of script the set of Ranch Wagon scripts I just bought on EBAY the script is 16.5 inches long and more of a cursive script. I can send pictures to your email if you want me to. I think maybe the longer scripts would be for the rear of the car.
Raven: Is the 12 inch script you mention the same as in the link I posted a couple days ago (second message up from this one). And is your RW a '57 Tudor Ranch Wagon, also? Thanks, Ron
Yes Ron the script on my '57 Tudor RW. I have a complete one on my drivers front fender that is the same as in the link but the one on the passenger fender only says RanchWag. I have a friend that says he can cast in pewter the script, If I ever remove the complete script from the left fender I will have him try a run.
Raven Rider: Thanks for that info. I think it confirms that at least I have the correct script. No rush, but when you get a chance could you measure your script and see if it's 12" long from the widest points on each end; and as to height, from the top to the bottom of the large "W" in "Wagon" is it 1 5/16"? Many thanks, Ron...
I know it is 12" long and I think your right on the height too.
Compared mine today. Same as the picture referenced in a PP. Not to beat this dead horse any more, BUT I researched the OEM Illustration and the Parts manuals. There are two versions of the FRONT FENDER NAME PLATE...base part # 16098. One was used on the '52 and '53 Ranch Wagons and the other on '54-'57 Ranch Wagons. The early one is about the same size but the script style is slightly different. Since the early version was used on only two model years, it would be the rare and not likely found. The later version is about 12" long with a casting/engineering # BAC-5925622-A found on the backside of the 'W'. 1958 and newer Ranch Wagons used a more flowing script style, are longer, and mounted on the quarter. Since they are quarter trim, they have their own base part number.
Quote from: Ron on 2014-12-14 15:26
And is your RW a '57 Tudor Ranch Wagon, also? Thanks, Ron
Am I wrong in assuming all '52-'57 Ranch Wagons are Tudor????????? In '58 when the name plate went to the quarter, Ranch Wagons were offered in 2 or 4 door. ...or am I just making this up??
Gasman--As always, great info. Here's some more input to add to this developing script mystery: on the Tudor Ranch Wagon script that I have there is this number on the back of the R (not on back of the W as in your script): BN-16098-D. The real mystery to me, though, is why my script has 5 mounting studs on the back and yours has 6. And as I said before, I have looked very closely at mine, even using a magnifying glass, and there is no sign of an additional stud that may have broken off. My guess, for what it's worth, is that Ford had two suppliers for this same script and one of them produced script with 5 studs, and the other produced script like yours with 6 studs. Any theories? And in case you're wondering, the only reason I'm pursuing this bit of trivia is because I'm trying to find the correct template to use when I mark and drill the holes in my fender to mount my script. Thanks again for taking the time to send me the info from yours. Ron
Wish I could contribute. Guys don't let this go, I really find this interesting.
Quote from: gasman826 on 2014-12-15 17:25
Am I wrong in assuming all '52-'57 Ranch Wagons are Tudor????????? In '58 when the name plate went to the quarter, Ranch Wagons were offered in 2 or 4 door. ...or am I just making this up??
Looks like the 2 doors were Ranch Wagons/Del Rio and the 4 doors were Country Sedans/Squires.
All the 58 pictures I found all the 2 doors were Ranch wagons, couldn't find a 4 door.
That's good info. All done on Google? Ron...
All you will ever need to know here......
http://www.1957ford.com/asp/modellist.aspx?catmstrid=1
Quote from: Ford Blue blood on 2014-12-15 22:32
All you will ever need to know here......
http://www.1957ford.com/asp/modellist.aspx?catmstrid=1
I've used that site many times, sometimes just to look at all the pictures. I'm surprised it is still up as there doesn't seem to be anything new posted in years. I tried to join at one time with no results..
I have really enjoyed that site through the past few years and I appreciate the effort and love that went into it. I am thinking Mr. Gambill was responsible. I think I have seen some of his vehicles for sale here and elsewhere and I hope all is well. I also think he is a member of this forum. I hope he sees this and I would like to thank him if all my thinking isn't in left field.
Quote from: hiball3985 on 2014-12-15 20:11
Looks like the 2 doors were Ranch Wagons/Del Rio
yes, just fyi the Del Rio had its name only on paper. there is no such thing as a Del Rio script. but the Rio (300 custom trim)has the Ranch Wagon script on the quarter panels, just below the fins, where the 4dr Country sedans would have their script.
the lower series Ranchwagon ( with the straight side trim) has the script on the front fenders ahead of the doors.
so this is a different area with probably a different shape of the body. maybe that's the reason for two different script designs ?
my del rio had the script shaved off unfortunately so I can't be of any help with this.
here's pics of what I mean.
the rio's script looks to be gold anodized.
Don't know if this is factory og or owner customized
it looks as if the body panel (crown) radius would be much smaller on the quarter panel than on the front fender
I had a plan to ask my daughter to measure the script on her Del Rio but it had already been sold along with all the side moldings. She stripped all of it, and filled the holes, even the door handles before she painted it. I was SO pissed I couldn't see straight. But she had already put a Chevy engine/trans in it so it already a piece of crap with or without the trim. This is really a hard subject for me to talk about :005: They must put something weird in the water in San Diego :003:
dj: Is that your Del Rio? Beautiful car! BTW, looking closely at the script on the Del Rio's rear fender and at the script on the Tudor Ranch Wagon's front fender, I think I noticed something: All the letters appear the same except for the "R" in "Ranch." The top of the "R" on the Del Rio script seems wider and a bit more ornate than the "R" on the Tudor Ranch Wagon script. Do you agree? This could explain why the "Ranch Wagon" script I have has 5 mounting studs on the back, and the "Ranch Wagon" script that Gasman has uses 6 mounting studs. Do you happen to know how many studs there are on the script mounted on the rear fender of that nice Del Rio? If there are 5, then there's a good chance the script I have in hand are not the ones I need for my Tudor Ranch Wagon. And that would be a bummer because these are so hard to find. Ron...
Ron, the scripts look pretty much the same to me. the Rio in the pic isn't mine unfortunately, just took the pic for comparison. as mentioned earlier the scripts have been shaved before on my car, but I will try to look inside the panels, stud pattern should be visible inside, I doubt that they hammer welded the holes shut. I'll look for it today.
DJ--Thanks. That would be a big help. Ron
There were two emblems made from ford and my theory is the reason for the six pins on the Del Rio is because the rear fenders also are Ranchero fenders . The Ranchero uses 6 pins for their emblems and ford had to use all the holes . I have both emblems and they are the same size and the mourning pins are in the same location minus the missing pin on the W .
dgasman: Wow, in two pictures it looks like you've solved the whole issue. And the further good news is that the two scripts I have with the 5 mounting studs/pins are apparently correct for my '57 Tudor Ranch Wagon. Many thanks to you and everyone else who got involved in this thread for taking the time to take pictures and otherwise educate me re the fenders on the Del Rio, the Tudor and the Ranchero, etc. A huge help for me. Now to get them mounted in the right location on my Tudor Ranch Wagon. Ron...
Upon looking closer at the emblems there is a difference , the 5 pin emblem is flatter , the 6 pin emblem has a slight curve . It hard to see in the pic but if you look closely its there
dgasman: The script on the right in the picture still has the barrel clips attached to the studs. Any idea what their inside diameter is? I need to locate 10 of them for my project. Thanks, Ron...
Quote from: dgasman on 2014-12-18 11:50
Upon looking closer at the emblems there is a difference , the 5 pin emblem is flatter , the 6 pin emblem has a slight curve . It hard to see in the pic but if you look closely its there
what I thought. 5 pin= flat= Ranch wagon front fender
6pin = curved= Del Rio rear fender
here's the rear quarter panel of my Del Rio
6 script holes
dj--Nice picture. Looks like you had to remove the rear wheel and probably get the car up on a jack stand to safely get the shot. A bit of work in cold weather. Thanks for doing that, though. I am now comfortable that my 5-pin script is correct for my Tudor Ranch Wagon's front fenders. Ron...
Ron, It was much easier than you think. I have my interior apart for getting upholstered so I just had to point my camera from inside of the car into the rear quarter area.
Quote from: dgasman on 2014-12-18 11:50
Upon looking closer at the emblems there is a difference , the 5 pin emblem is flatter , the 6 pin emblem has a slight curve . It hard to see in the pic but if you look closely its there
Such a minor detail but finally an answer. Super!!!!
I never noticed my six pin name plates have a slight curve! It appears that I have a pair of Del Rio Ranch Wagon name plates. So now I'm in search of a pair of Custom Ranch Wagon name plates.
Thanks for everyone's effort, time and research to resolve this issue!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Gasman: That great info and photo that dgasman posted brings up another interesting question: the template sketch you posted on here a few days ago to help me determine where to mount the script on my '57 Tudor Wagon indicates your fender has six holes. If you traced that template off the front fender of your '57 Tudor wagon, does that mean your car came from the factory with the Del Rio Script on the fenders? Stranger things have happened on the assembly line, I know, but it seems unlikely that the "curved" script would look right on a flat fender. What are your thoughts? Thanks, Ron...
I was wrong. The template was taken off the fender with five holes and the sixth added for the incorrect name plate that is the Del Rio name plate not a Custom name plate. The template also matches the five holes on the Courier fender.