So I'm used to lowering a car with lowering blocks out back & cutting the springs up front.
But there's better ways now-
(this time I'd like to de-arch my springs instead of blocks...)
And for the front end is there another way (as far as alignment goes) besides cutting/changing the springs or changing over to disc brakes & dropped spindles?
What's up with "Aerostar" springs please? Are those way better than cutting the springs?
Thanks!
The best way to lower the front is dropped spindles, the suspension travel stays the same. I have Aerostar springs but they lowered the car too much so I had to add spacers. They are shorter and have a 50% higher spring rate with the same outside diameter and ends. Without the spacers there was only maybe an inch of travel. Cutting the stock springs with increase the spring rate but you can "dial" in the height if you are careful. I personally think lowering blocks are the best way to lower the back, you know exactly how much you will get. You can have stock springs de-arched but that requires a good spring shop, I never have tied that. Another option is custom wound springs for the front and maybe custom springs for the rear as well?
Cutting the coils is a good option. The spring rate increase is not very noticeable unless you get carried away. Rule of thumb is 1" of spring removed = 2" drop. Use a cutoff wheel, never a torch!
My local spring shop got me exactly 2" of rear height to clear the slicks on my racecar with no problem at all.
Ron.
I used S10 springs rather than Aerostar. They dropped the front about 2 inches.
James
Quote from: Fairlane62 on 2022-08-21 21:38I used S10 springs rather than Aerostar. They dropped the front about 2 inches.
James
What year S10?
ThanksJohn
They were multiple year. They were Moog #5658 through Summit.
James
The Dimensions for Moog Front Coil Spring Part Number 5658 are the following. The Inner Diameter is 4.08in, Bar Diameter .68in, Spring Rate - 530.00 lbs per in, Load - 1405.00 Lbs, Installation Height - 10.75in, Free Height- 13.35 in and its a constant rate.
The stock Ford Springs are 400,430, and 500 lbs per inch with the free height that varies between 13.65 in and 15.55 in. The installed height at normal load is 9.60 in across the board.
Moog CC850 (Aerostar Springs) are 605 lbs per in, Free Height is 11.65
A couple of simple calculations implies that the drop you'd see with S10 springs is a function of what Ford springs you have. The Aerostar springs really are too short to start with.
Another point to consider is that the difference in change of the installed height of the spring is not the amount the car is lowered/raised. Lower A arm geometry will amplify the change.
Quote from: Ford Blue blood on 2021-09-11 07:57....Rule of thumb is 1" of spring removed = 2" drop. Use a cutoff wheel, never a torch!
Please clarify. Are you saying that cutting 1"off the end of the spring will give you a 2" drop or do you mean that the 1" is a vertical measurement? I can't feature 1" off the end of the spring = a 2" drop.
I stand the spring up and rotate it unit there is a 1" mark, that is to say with the 57 springs that have a pig tail that sits down in a recess vice being able to stand up on a flat surface I turn until the bottom of the coil going up the spring is at the 1" on the tape. Not sure that makes sense. But shortening the spring 1" yields about a 1 - 1&1/2 to 2" drop. This is because the location of the spring on the control arm, about halfway between the inner pivot and the spindle.
https://57fordsforever.com/smf/index.php?topic=6035.60
about 1/2 way down this page.
Tom the lower A arm pivots at one end and supports the car on the other (through the ball joint). The spring is in the center (more or less) of the A arm. A 2" movement at the ball joint moves the spring 1". hope that helps...
Quote from: Ford Blue blood on 2024-01-18 07:49....until the bottom of the coil going up the spring is at the 1" on the tape. Not sure that makes sense ... But shortening the spring 1" yields about a 1 - 1&1/2 to 2" drop.
Thanks for the reply, Bill.
Yeah, considering that you mention the tape but not it's location your description is kinda odd. But it sounds like what I was trying to depict by the spring on the right in the pic I attached. It is also what I expected it would have to be. Saying '1" of spring removed = 2" drop' might lead some to believe that cutting 1" off the end of the spring would = a 2" drop. That didn't make sence to me & I just wanted to clear that up. I guess another way to put it might be to say 'taking 1" off of the free height of the spring = about a 2" drop.
Your Ranchero is beautiful! Very beautiful!
It might not bean exact 2 : 1 ratio, but it's pretty damn close, and we are talking height inches, not coils. If I remember correctly, I needed a 2" drop and Lynn did the calculations for me, saying I needed to cut 1 1/4" of height off. It ended up being exactly what I was looking for. Yeah, as mentioned, it's the inner location of the springs projected out to the spindle location that makes for that ratio.
Lynn, your description is pretty good. Man! It's been about 60 years since I cut any coil springs. Two different cars that belonged to two different friends. We didn't have diddly for tools & managed to cut the lighter set with a hacksaw. Didn't have much luck doing that with the heavier set. Ended up walking them about a mile & a half away & a guy cut them with a torch! If cut-off wheels for metal even existed 60 years ago we didn't know about them.
BTW, I'm very well versed on all types of automobile suspension systems & how they work. Studied them a lot. There is no question that the best way to lower the front is to use dropped spindles. I keep thinking that long ago here I saw that someone does manufacture dropped spindles for our '57s.
There was a guy on the Hamb that sold kits for years. He used Granada spindles, (Lincoln Versailles are the same, I believe). His name was Dave, and his company was "Drop N Stop". He had to quit making the kits a few years back because of health issues. He's still on the Hamb, a great guy willing to share his knowledge even if you weren't going to buy from him. When you ordered the kit, he'd give you the option of 1 1/2 or 2" drop, and ream the spindles accordingly. That's where I got my spindle/disc brake kit. I did not get the master/booster from him because I needed to go with Hydroboost.
Something in the back of my head is telling me there is another option available now......is it Scarebird??? I'm not sure if it's a dropped spindle kit, or just a disc brake kit fitting our original spindles.
Don't use a torch for cutting coils, the heat will ruin the temper.
Fatman Fabrication makes dropped spindles that fit 57 Fords $725 a pair, I scored a pair on ebay years ago for a $125 the guy said they came with a 57 sedan delivery he was turning into a gasser and had no use for them.
I cut springs in the '60s with hacksaw blades, lots of blades!
Fatman makes dropped spindles....
Yes they make dropped spindles, back when I got mine they were set up for granada rotors and calipers Im not sure what there using now, they also make upper and lower control arms. Im using 2" lowering blocks in the back also.
i looked at their website today and they seem to imply they have "new" G2 spindles that will take stock brakes or others aftermarket disc brake conversions at a cheaper price than before.... I plan on calling them for clarification.
Quote from: 57chero on 2024-01-19 00:51Fatman Fabrication makes dropped spindles that fit 57 Fords $725 a pair ....
Yeah, $725. And that's why most people just cut the springs. BTW, the dropped spindles, like these, are the ones I was referring to when I mentioned them before, not the Granada ones with their built in lack of the caster that our '57s, '58s & '59s need.
Quote from: lalessi1 on 2024-01-19 09:00I cut springs in the '60s with hacksaw blades, lots of blades!
The first springs we cut with, I think, only one blade were on a 49 thru 52 type chev. Probably cut too much off of those skinny springs. The next ones we
tried* to hacksaw were in a 55 or 56 mopar & were a lot heavier & apparently tougher steel. We weren't getting anywhere on those with a hacksaw & that led to that long walk to & back from that guy with that torch. :085: Hey, that was 60 years ago & being a couple young kids probably didn't know any better. I don't know if the heat on just the very end of the springs did them much harm but I sure wouldn't recommend using the cutting torch method.
Look at this page and scroll down....
https://www.fatmanfab.com/dropped-uprights-spindles
"1957-1968 Galaxie" Our exclusive G-Tech 2" drop spindle- raised upper ball joint increases camber gain in turns for better handling- uses OEM or OEM replacement disc brake upgrades. $389/pair"
This is new if it's not a typo
Ditto on the torch.
Quote from: lalessi1 on 2024-01-23 08:25Look at this page and scroll down....
https://www.fatmanfab.com/dropped-uprights-spindles
"1957-1968 Galaxie" Our exclusive G-Tech 2" drop spindle- raised upper ball joint increases camber gain in turns for better handling- uses OEM or OEM replacement disc brake upgrades. $389/pair"
This is new if it's not a typo
With the way they have that listed there I'm not sure what product anyone would get. That listing looks like they have them lumped in with Mustangs, Falcons, Torinos, etc. And "raised upper ball joint"? What are they talking about? A longer upper section of the spindle?
Doesn't make sense that they are selling one set of 2" dropped spindles for $725 & another for $389. If that was so they might as well forget about selling the $725 set. Yeah, maybe a very misleading typo.
https://hotrodhardware.com/search?type=product&options%5Bprefix%5D=last&options%5Bunavailable_products%5D=last&q=1957+Ford+++++G-Tech+2%22+drop+spindle