engine out of a 95 mark VIII,4r70w transmission from a 2001 f150[trans has better parts inside]going with a 3.56 posi diff,coil on plug,2001 cobra exhaust manifolds,going to try run the 6 cyl rad. using the early 93 computer[no speed limiter and no anti theft] will try to take pictures.i am hoping this will let me get into traffic better than my 6 cyl
This has been a long time coming, Gary! Congrats on the start...yours will still be a driver before mine, lol. Seriously, that's great, Gary...keep us posted, and pics as you go.
Any progress?
have about one more day of getting the garage organized.thinking of swaping the front brakes first[need the weight to swap the spindles]i picked up some cams from a mustang cobra will swap them when the engine is on the stand,hope to start on the project later this week
Any idea how many HP the cams will add? Did you buy them new or find a used set somewhere?
now that i have my furnace fixed,pulled the trans off the engine and got it on a stand.the cams should give 10 or 15 hp.but will loose some bottom end torque.i have a second set of cams,these are reground ones by colt cams.close to the same duration,but higher lift.my engine dyno program says these may be a better choice,more torque and hp below 3500 rpm,about the same as stock at higher rpm.all ebay stuff.
just a update,going over the engine found a few issues,changing the rod bearings,repairing some of the timing chain parts,replacing valve seals,putting in cobra valve springs,and the colt cams.waiting for some of the parts to show up.swaped in my lincoln versailles front brakes,bolted right up[has a bigger lower ball joint hole than the granada]found some outer tie rods from a 77 town car that look like they will fit[a little long,as long as i can set the toe,they will be fine]getting ready to pull the front clip
Glad you got some heat going up there, and you're making some progress. Are you still planning on using/modifying the MK Viii wiring harness? Keep us posted...I'm sure you'll end up doing stuff different than I did, so I'm really anxious to see how you approach some of the little problem areas.
still planing on using the markVIII harness.
the point of no return
No turning back now!! That's a heck of a garage you've got there..something new? Don't forget to replace those cowl drain tubes while you've got her apart. I sure envy your lift...especially after having to crawl under my jacked up car to try and reach all the tranny connectors. Sometime after my car is up and driving, I've got to get it over to my friends shop so I can properly wrap all the tranny wires....for now, just too hard to reach.
Gary...some things I didn't do on mine that I should have when I was at the stage you are at:
#1..trim the passenger side control arm bracket...the rear ear, about 3/8 or 1/2 vertically. The control arm itself should be ok.
#2..trim the firewall/cowl weld flange back to flush right in the center where it is already narrowed down.....air inlet to the throttle body is very tight in that area.
#3...consider how far back you want the engine to sit when you slot the motor mount pads. I moved mine back a little further than you and Claiborn were indicating to clear my rack and pinion. One advantage of this is the driveshaft from the Mark VIII will work, but just barely. I'm intending to "get it right" when I redo my rear differential by changing to a taller differential yoke. Another inch of spine engagement at the tranny will be perfect. If I remember correctly, I had the plain of the belhousing 4 1/2" from the firewall....a little more after I raised the tranny to it's final resting height.
Another advantage of moving it back is more room for the electric fans up front, and also the tranny mount holes will be in a better position.
A disadvantage of moving it back is I had to modify the oil pan to clear the engine crossmember. I actually pie cut the oil pan and rewelded it. This turned out to be a pain in the butt because that oil pan is a double wall affair.. If I had to do it over again, I'd seriously consider denting in the back corner of the pan with a big ball pein hammer....seriously.
I feel like the student telling the teacher
Just remembered...those slots on the motor mount pads....be aware that the Mustang motor mounts we are using have the main stud location at a different height right side to left side.... so this obviously means the slots won't be cut at the same height either
i have wanted a nice shop for about 30 years.spent most of last year getting it to this point.i am not getting any younger,if i did not do it now,may not have done it at all.my plan is fit the trans to the stock crossmember.go back till the trans pan just clears.i have the motor mount pads/brakets i cut off a mustang.going to weld them on over the 57 mounts
if you check my other posts you will see i am doing the steering and brakes at the same time[and now the wipers]
using my 65 mustang as a bench
Very nice bench :003:
I always wanted a rolling bench. Nice...future project?...looks pretty solid and complete.
could use a paint job,rest of car is pretty good.put over 3000 miles on it last year
painting the frame and steering parts,then in goes the steering and then the engine :003:
got a bunch of painting done.when i was cleaning the frame i found the upper control arm bushings poor.so i am doing that now also.and while the r/h control arm is off i cut the back ear off.thanks Rich for reminding me to do this :003:
took the upper control arms off and decided,if i am this far,i will do the lower bushings too.so i took them off.all the pins came out with a impact.surprised me,on a car almost 60 years old
Ha...that "while I'm at it" is a virus I think. If you don't, you'll wish you had.
It got me until there were NO more "while I'm at it" 's to be done. Sounds like you're enjoying working in your new envoirment anyway.
I'm not sure but I think using a Mustang for a work bench is considered a sin !
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2015-01-27 08:22
Ha...that "while I'm at it" is a virus I think. If you don't, you'll wish you had.
It got me until there were NO more "while I'm at it" 's to be done. Sounds like you're enjoying working in your new envoirment anyway.
more of a calling
a hoist is nice,took about 1 hour to pull all the control arms off
Now's the time to do this stuff. x2 on the hoist. I like your wall liner...galvanized corrugated...cool. Are you working in another garage with a taller ceiling for your hoist?
Gary...check out his post#4 on this thread
the part of the garage the mustang is in is the original 24'x24' garage.i removed the back wall and added 30'x32' with 12.5' wall addition.the picture of the 57 on the hoist shows that part.the wall liner is roofing tin,harder to set on fire and reflects light well. almost done cleaning the frame,paint,then the control arms go back on
some progress.see my post under steering and suspension for some info on control arms
Nothing better than fresh shiney paint. Looking good.
some more progress.i also see this is my 500th post :booty:
Looks good. Curious what spindle is that, looks like a spacer on the lower ball joint?
Congrats on your 500th post...just think where you'd be at if you hadn't abandoned us for a few years!...(just giving you a hard time). That's looking real good, Gary. You're moving right along.
Jim...I can't remember what spindles he's using, but they look like the Granada's I'm using. The spindle doesn't go all the way down on the ball joint. The spindle mounting arm would normally go down to the top of the ball joint's rubber grease boot. I used a section of heavy walled rubber fuel hose to fill in the gap and keep the boot in place..it looks like he used a big nut. He may have had a different reason.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2015-02-05 08:39
Congrats on your 500th post...just think where you'd be at if you hadn't abandoned us for a few years!...(just giving you a hard time). That's looking real good, Gary. You're moving right along.
Jim...I can't remember what spindles he's using, but they look like the Granada's I'm using. The spindle doesn't go all the way down on the ball joint. The spindle mounting arm would normally go down to the top of the ball joint's rubber grease boot. I used a section of heavy walled rubber fuel hose to fill in the gap and keep the boot in place..it looks like he used a big nut. He may have had a different reason.
I can't tell a Granada from a Galaxie, I'm just not up to speed on this late model stuff :003:. I wonder if the spindle doesn't go down further because it wasn't reamed? I have Granadas and they go down almost all the way. I had to add two washers to the top to bring the nut up so the original cottor pin hole could be used.
the spindles are from a lincoln versailles[they have a bigger lower ball joint hole than the granada,do not need to ream]rich is right,i used a nut as a spacer to hold down the boot.cotter pin hole lines up perfect.
a little more progress
I have a 1957 ford fairlane 500 and I'm putting a 1999 mustang cobra motor ( 4.6 doch modular motor) I need help on the pedal set up. My motor is a 5 speed. I was just wondering what was everyone was using. Thank you for the help.
in my 57 fairlane, i'm using an automatic. have a 5 speed in my 63 falcon with 03 mach one. used cable on it. works great. so does hydraulic slave setup, preferrable to stock z bar setup.
So was you able to hook a cable to the stock clutch pedal?
had to modify the top of the pedal to accept the cable. drilled a hole through firewall for cable to pass through, and used a firewall adjuster to adjust freeplay'
where I can pick up a firewall adjuster at? Can you please post any pictures if you have them? Thank you for the help
update.got the front suspension done the front brakes are on and plumbed and installed a heavy duty front sway bar.took the diff apart,am cleaning and painting the diff parts.test fitting the rear sway bar and exhaust parts.there is not allot of room back there.had hoped to mount my fuel pump by the tank,not sure if i have room now
looks like if i rotate the tail pipes above the springs[cut and weld],i will have room for the fuel pump and sway bar
I was trying to find a reference to your rear sway bar and couldn't....so, what are you fitting?
a few years ago i picked up a sway bar kit,front and rear, from concours parts for my ranchero.since the ranchero and wagon are the same frame the rear bar fits[good thing i kept them when i sold my ranchero] :003:
There is a question that has come up regarding back spacing of the front wheels and clearance for the sway bar at full lock. Can you shed any light on this issue?
with my granada spindles,14"granada wheels,215/75/14" tires and borgeson box,i have about a 1/4 of clearance between the tire and sway bar at full lock.when the suspension is at ride hight,it will have a little more clearance[i think]
Thanks for that info! :003: It's another "point on the curve". What is the back spacing on Granada wheels.... I'll start a thread...
here are some progress pictures.the second and 3rd pictures are of my fuel pump install[not finished yet]
update,got the diff together with the 3.56 posi gears,put the 1968 brakes on,and replaced the shocks.should have my engine parts thursday
what did the gears come out of? Axels?
a few years ago i rebuilt this center section from my pile of 9" stuff[for another project].1964 heavy duty case,mid 70's 4 pinion posi unit,28 spline to fit early axles.gears are mid 60's[3.56 till 1968,3.50 from 1969]the housing and axles are from the wagon
The 73 F100 I had was equipped with a 3:55 posi in a "N" carrier with 31 spline axles. 360/granny gear 4 speed. Ordered it that way, the "N" and 31 spline was a real suprise!
checked my local parts store for new brake drums to fit the 1968 brakes i am using[why not]would you believe they had them in stock :booty:
I'm going to post this here and on other threads to make sure guys see it....
Warning on Anchor motor mounts...there's been alot of posts on the Hamb about what is getting to be a high failure rate for Anchor brand motor mounts. As could be figured, apparently this stems from the once reliable company swithching to chinese manufacture. Apparently the issue is even being articled in the monthly magazines.
When I did mine, I thought about the urathane mounts that cost 4 times as much, but the sqeaking issue with urathane and their 4X cost, and Anchor's reputation at that time led me to chose Anchors. I'm going to keep a close eye on mine...may replace them if it looks like it'll be easier without the front fenders on.
Anyways, for you guys starting the 4.6 swap You may want to figure another option than Anchors if you haven't already. Gary, I think you mentioned along time ago you had a pair of Mustang OEM's.
i used the stock mark viii fluid filled mounts on my conversion. welded a piece of angle on the 57 pad to make it horizontal, then vertical bolt in mount through a hole in angle. oem mounts that fit right and were cheap to boot. [they came with engine].
yes my mounts are oem mustang
update.new drums on.rear brake lines not done yet,need to fit exhaust.got some of my engine parts today.rest should be in by wednesday
update.got the cowl aria all cleaned up and painted,ready to put my wipers in.also redid my gauges[see my other post].found my heater control was broken,something else to fix
got a chance today to go parts hunting.a person i know has a few 57-59 fords.trying to get a heater control,59 signal light switch,and a 59 hood latch you guys say is better
once you use the hood latch, you will see the difference.
Man, I put the '59 latch on mine a week or so ago....unbelievable difference!
trying to put in my wiper cables.you need lots of patience and small hands.and right now i have neither :005:
Pull the left side fresh air vent, full view of the pulley....
I'm put a 4.6 swap into my 57 ford and I'm going to use the 5 speed transmission, I was just wondering if anyone else used the 5 speed transmission and what clutch pedal set did you use? Thanks for the help
Quote from: r stewart on 2015-02-26 07:24
I'm put a 4.6 swap into my 57 ford and I'm going to use the 5 speed transmission, I was just wondering if anyone else used the 5 speed transmission and what clutch pedal set did you use? Thanks for the help
check out the cable clutch kits for the early mustangs.they may work
Quote from: Ford Blue blood on 2015-02-26 07:16
Pull the left side fresh air vent, full view of the pulley....
yes i did that, just need to take my time
found a post from about 5 years ago on the wiper cable install.i followed that and the install went well. :booty:
update.going to leave the steering column out till i get the wiring done.have all my engine parts now.should be almost ready to put the engine in by sunday night
found a issue with the intake,will need to replace the intake gaskets[it is almost like the gods do not want me to finish this project]
I'm sure you will, but while you're in there check the two electrical wire connectors that run under the intake.
here are some of the tools you need to replace valve seals and install the cobra springs
got the bearings and the cams in along with cleaning and painting.the cams have a smaller base circle so you need to set the lifter preload[32 times]so it takes a little time
having some problems getting the reground cams to time.two steps ahead and 4 back
got the cams all timed up.went to the red deer spring swap meet and found a new timing chain and gear set cheap.so do i take it apart and put in new or leave it as is?
How many miles on the engine? Aren't these engines a major problem if the timing chain breaks?
If I had more engine mechanical know-how, I would have replaced the one on my 52k engine while it was out.
LOL, I suspect since you bought it, you already pretty much have an idea of what you'll do.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2015-03-21 18:47
How many miles on the engine? Aren't these engines a major problem if the timing chain breaks?
If I had more engine mechanical know-how, I would have replaced the one on my 52k engine while it was out.
LOL, I suspect since you bought it, you already pretty much have an idea of what you'll do.
just finished putting it in :003:
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2015-03-21 17:36
got the cams all timed up.went to the red deer spring swap meet and found a new timing chain and gear set cheap.so do i take it apart and put in new or leave it as is?
If it ain't broke don't fix it! My MK VIII had 135K on it when I sold it. Never turned a screw on the engine out side of the drain plug!
still waiting for intake gaskets,rest of the motor is together.now on to the transmission,need to change it over to be compatible with the mark VIII computer
been busy with the grandkids.some update pictures.first one is the tools you need to swap cams/timing chains.next one is of the valve body[putting in a shift kit] and other parts i am upgrading.last one is the torque converter control solenoid you need to change to work with the early computer
had a new helper today,she is 5 years old.guess how much work i got done.
Probably lots more than you realize. Good chance she'll remember these days for the rest of her life. That's work well done.
BTW, I looked, I didn't have one of those Ford engine cam tool kits in any of my tool boxes, lol.
engine in :003: mounts almost done[need to weld]other pictures of are how i modified the mounts with the mustang frame parts.now the bad news the drivers side cobra manifold will not work with the borgeson box.the stock mark VIII manifolds are stainless steel,and can be welded.will see if i can make/modify them to work.had my helper again today,talked her into sweeping the floor[not a bad job for 5 years old] [had to pay her to do it]
Whoa...that is a total surprise with the Borgenson box. Aren't they smaller than the oem boxes? Dumb question here..how did you determine that? the exhaust manifolds aren't on, and they won't go on with the studs attached to the head. I had to replace my newly replaced studs with bolts.
Great idea with the Mustang frame components.
I was trying to get some engine position references to see how far back you set the engine. Looking at the engine mount stud, I'm thinking it may be 1 1/2 or so further frontwards than what I did. How much clearance do you have at the oil pan/crossmember? If it were/can be moved back further, would it give you enough clearance for the steering box? Looking at mine, I assume the clearance problem is with the manifold flange? I was trying to remember what Claiborn did with his, I think he used headers. I do remember he had the oem power steering setup.
Is your tranny attached?
I talked to a guy in Phoenix that put a 4.6 dohc in a '54 merc. He used two driver's side Markviii manifolds, cutting one apart to switch/reweld the front and back ends.
the problem with the box is the pitman arm is higher than stock.the manifold fits but there is no room for the exhaust pipe.found that out on my first test fit.there is about a inch clearance between the back of the oil pan and the crossmember.i have about 1/2 inch between the trans pan and the trans crossmember.used a trans mount from a 2000 crown vic.here are some pictures
update on the exhaust problem.i reinstalled the cobra manifold and with exhaust pipe mods,i think i can make it work.about 1/2 inch clearance.look at the pictures,give me your opinion.
Boy that's tight, but looks like it should work. The arm doesn't look like it could swing over far enough to hit the exhaust flange. BTW, I just noticed you trimmed both sides of the upper control arm frame bracket...that's what I'm guessing is allowing you to get the engine set down there with the manifolds on.? I assumed you raised up the engine to put them on. I think even with the ears trimmed you can't get them over the studs with the engine sitting on the mounts.
That borgenson box allowed you to set the engine where you did...probably 1 1/2 forward from mine. It saved you having alter the oil pan and the tranny crossmember to get the engine back far enough to clear a r & P. Room for electric fans shouldn't be an issue as you're swapping to cop's. It'll give more room to fiddle with egr valve stuff, and give you more room for a better throttle cable action. Also, you'll have an easier time with the intake for the throttle body. The only downsides I can see.... You'll have to do something for a driveshaft, The Mark Viii is about an inch short if ideal on mine....and coming up with radiator hoses may be a little tricky, esp the bottom one.
I'm pretty sure I used the CV tranny mount on mine as well. Just needed some minor alteration if I remember. The combination of metric and sae on this drivetrain and it's mountings is a pain in the butt, isn't it.
rich,the steering arm is as for right as it goes.the left side manifold can be installed with the engine in place.i have deleted the egr so that will not be a issue.did you need to move the e brake cable mount?looks like the exhaust will hit.
I didn't move it, but I did cut and reweld it so it angled the cable down a bit more to help clear the exhaust. My exhaust was in back to the H pipe, but has room for adjustments after I get some hangers put in. The way the oem e cable bracket was, it was wanting to pull the pivoting arms up into the exhaust. I'm not sure if I can avoid that 100%, but it's definetly better.
the first picture is the mounts all welded in and painted.the next picture is what i will be starting on after the engine is in
Top picture looks great, Gary. Bottom picture might as well be a barn full of snakes for me..either way, I'd be dead in the water.
bottom picture looks like my floor few ago. as for driveshaft, i ended up with 63 inches in my 2 door hardtop.
Gary - You are awesome :), what beautiful work. I can only aspire... I very much look forward to seeing you this summer. My efforts on my 57 pale in comparison but I relish listening to your efforts and experience. Well done Sir.
update.first picture is of the port matching i did on the manifolds before i put them on.next ones are of the left exhaust,2 1/2 pipe.[needs finished welding]i think there is enough clearance between the exhaust and the steering box.the pitman arm is all the way to the right. last picture is of the shift linkage[not finished yet]stock 57 auto linkage modifyed to fit the 4r70w trans.the arm was cut off the 57 and welded to the cut off 4r70w one.see picture 3.must use truck trans to get shift arm on the outside of the shifter switch.
Love the pics, its like stopping by and checking on your progress. I don't comment often but I look everyday, keep 'em coming! :003:
Looking great. What are you doing for the exhaust pipe sections as far as bends, etc.?
I meant to ask last week...did you make any modifications to the dipstick? I forgot to make a physical measurement before I installed the oil pan, but I don't think it's hitting.
i have a flowmaster exhaust kit from a 65/70 mustang and a box of leftover pipe from a other universal flowmaster kit.[all 2 1/2].i modified the dipstick tube by bending it toward the sump,put the bend between the block and pan.had to shorten the end of the dipstick a little so it would go through the bend.then checked the hight of the full mark and matched that to the pan.the oil level needs to be above the low oil level sender so there will be oil in the back part of the pan.that is why i put in a windage tray.i hope this helps you,rich.going to work on the right exhaust pipe today
The question was mostly out of curiosity, and making sure I hadn't missed something. I went the easy route since I forgot to measure anything when the pan was off. The easy way meaning I didn't do anything except check the oil capacity for the Continental version of the engine (I know the oil pans are smaller than the Mark viii's). I put that much in and the oil came to the full mark on the dipstick, so I called it good.
update.got the right hand exhaust tacked in place.got looking at my pile of parts/junk[that is what the wife calls it] and found a drive shaft from a 67 cougar that will fit,2 inches longer than the mark VIII.would have taken pictures,but my camera's battery was dead
Sounds just about perfect. That's also good for the fairlane guys to know (depending on where they set their engine)
the fairlane is on the 118 inch wheel base.the wagon is on the small body[116 wb] that will add 2 inchs to the drive shaft length
Yes...exactly what I was saying. The two inches helps you with the forward placement of the engine. For Fairlane owners that move the engine back where mine is, that two inches may make the cougar driveshaft workable for them also.
the drive shaft may be from a 69 ford full size and not a 67 cougar
when i still had the exhaust in [removed to finish weld]i fitted the bracket for the e brake.this is a picture of the new placement.3 1/2 inch over and a little down.the cables clear the exhaust now.will post a assembled picture when i get it back togeather
update. got the exhaust back in [waiting for mufflers]second picture is of the e brake and how it clears the exhaust.last one is of my steering box clearance
decided to ream my spindles to fit the 57 tie rod ends
Hi Gents,
Hope you don't mind the chime in? I have just completed a 4.6 install as well. Looks like some of you have got the wiring issue sorted out? I am looking for a little guidance. My first EFI install, so pretty green. Was thinking Ron Francis harness. Any help, suggestions would be most appreciated. Thanks
Welcome to the forum. Unless you're an electrical wizard like some of these guys, I strongly reccomend the Ron Francis harness. I've never wired a car before, and had less trouble wiring the engine than I did the Vintage Air. It's expensive at 915., but worth every dollar. You really get alot for your money. Quality and instructions are excellent. You can imagine the smile on my face when the engine started on the first lick, and was not throwing any engine codes. Lots of things I could talk about but I already have in the "4.6 being installed now" thread.
There are a few more things you may or may not need other than the "basic" harness depending on your application. What is the donor vehicle? cooling fans? A/C?etc.
Thanks for the reply.
Glad to hear you were happy with the Francis kit. I called Ron Francis a couple of times now and they have indicated they make whatever I need. I guess that really is the issue...I don't know exactly what I need as I haven't done one of these before. Other than eliminating most of the emission stuff, not sure what else to consider.
Donor is a 2002 Crown Vic out of police cruiser(PI engine) with 4r70w tranny.
I will check out your other thread you mentioned.
update: working on the intake system.rich muise, i should have listened to you about triming the firewall[need to finish].had to do it now to make the intake ducting fit.lucky for me i had not installed the intake manifold.first pictures are of the triming and fitment of the intake ducting.last picture is of test fit of the mark VIII front part of the fuel line,looks like it will fit
Quote from: 61ford on 2015-04-16 12:38
Thanks for the reply.
Glad to hear you were happy with the Francis kit. I called Ron Francis a couple of times now and they have indicated they make whatever I need. I guess that really is the issue...I don't know exactly what I need as I haven't done one of these before. Other than eliminating most of the emission stuff, not sure what else to consider.
Donor is a 2002 Crown Vic out of police cruiser(PI engine) with 4r70w tranny.
I will check out your other thread you mentioned.
i would delete the back oxy sensors and the pats system to start with[some police cars did not have pats]with a computer reprogram.
Pats system? Just for my own edification!
Passive anti theft system. Computer talks to a "little black box" that talks to the ignition key. If the box doesn't tell the computer that the key belongs to this car the computer never puts a ground on the fuel injectors. You can make a PATS car fire with squirting gas into the intake while cranking but that is all you get.
Pull apart the column and you will find a ring around the ignition lock. It has three tiny wires that run to the "little black box", the box sends a signal to the ring and the key then responds, the box has many wires into it but bottom line, it tells the computer it OK to let the engine run..
The easiest way to tell is the ignition key...if it doesn't have a chip, it doesn't have the pats system. As Bill said, some/many/most/all ? police vehicles do not have the Pats system. Also, the Ron Francis kit only uses the two O2 sensors closest to the exhaust manifold, so delete the rear two that would be on the Mustang system....at least the Mark Viii version of the Ron Francis harness.
Gary....I'm surprised you had a clearance problem...did you move your engine back further than you had initially shown? Your throttle body looks to be about where mine is.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2015-04-17 10:30
The easiest way to tell is the ignition key...if it doesn't have a chip, it doesn't have the pats system. As Bill said, some/many/most/all ? police vehicles do not have the Pats system. Also, the Ron Francis kit only uses the two O2 sensors closest to the exhaust manifold, so delete the rear two that would be on the Mustang system....at least the Mark Viii version of the Ron Francis harness.
Gary....I'm surprised you had a clearance problem...did you move your engine back further than you had initially shown? Your throttle body looks to be about where mine is.
the pats and back oxy sensers are not on pre 1996[OBD1]. i think my clearance problem is caused by the angle of the engine,the mustang frame mounts raised the front of the engine up
Do you have the tranny in it's final resting place...height-wise? I found raising the tranny pivots the engine up and away from the firewall almost an equal amount. I was having trouble fitting the egr valve until I realized I had the tranny just sitting on the crossmember with a section of 2x4 to approximate the lowest estimated mounting height. When I raised it 1/2", I gained almost that much clearance at the firewall weld flange.
i do have the transmission on the mount.was thinking of making a spacer to raise the trans up to get a little more clearance
I had to pull my intake plenum off this week and noticed it was more difficult to squeeze it on/off than before. I just realized with our conversation here, that I may have forgot some thick washers under the tranny after had the crossmember out to rework the e cable bracket...have to get back under there and have a look.
Rich, I read your other post you suggested. Thanks for taking the time to post all of that, I enjoyed going thru it. I got the impression you ordered the wiring kit from Francis that was specific to your year of engine in that it is a standard kit with no deletions? Sounds like the instructions are very detailed as well. To be clear, the tranny harness comes with the engine harness, correct?
Canadian_Ranchero, thanks for the information as well. I will delete all emission stuff that I can, PATS, rear O2 sensors, ABS, Cruise. I want to retain the factory gauges on the dash. I think I will go with a externally mounted electric fuel pump. I will inform of them my intentions and hope they will make sure I am not missing anything else I can delete. I decided to go with a clutch fan, but will have them wire for electric fans for future?
Interesting reading the posts. My 4.6 is in a 61 Galaxie and I had to work thru the same issues...oil pan, engine mounts, tranny mounts, driveshaft. I also added disc brakes all around and went with Rack and Pinion and Hydroboost. Hey it ain't a 57 but pretty close?
Unlike the express harness kits which are not universal, but made for a specific vehicle, the Telorvek/Detail Zone/Ron Francis engine mngmt. harness is pretty much engine vintage specific, but otherwise universal, if that makes sense, in that everyone pretty much gets the same harness that's made for that vintage. I haven't looked into your year kit, but I assume it's the same as my 93-95 MKVIII kit in that if you don't use the components the kit was designed to include, it will throw engine codes and as Ron Francis puts it "will probabbly be running in some type of back up mode".Things that come to mind...egr system, intake sensors including MAF sensor, front O2 sensors, etc.
You'll get differing opinions on this forum about what to delete and what not to delete. With that said, you'll have less options on what to delete and what not to delete going with the RF kit.
Yes, the kit addresses the 4R70W tranmision wiring. Instructions were very clear for the most part...I only had to make a few phone calls.
quote...."I got the impression you ordered the wiring kit from Francis that was specific to your year of engine in that it is a standard kit with no deletions? correct Sounds like the instructions are very detailed as well. To be clear, the tranny harness comes with the engine harness, correct?" correct
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2015-04-20 23:21
Unlike the express harness kits which are not universal, but made for a specific vehicle, the Telorvek/Detail Zone/Ron Francis engine mngmt. harness is pretty much engine vintage specific, but otherwise universal, if that makes sense, in that everyone pretty much gets the same harness that's made for that vintage. I haven't looked into your year kit, but I assume it's the same as my 93-95 MKVIII kit in that if you don't use the components the kit was designed to include, it will throw engine codes and as Ron Francis puts it "will probabbly be running in some type of back up mode".Things that come to mind...egr system, intake sensors including MAF sensor, front O2 sensors, etc.
You'll get differing opinions on this forum about what to delete and what not to delete. With that said, you'll have less options on what to delete and what not to delete going with the RF kit.
Yes, the kit addresses the 4R70W tranmision wiring. Instructions were very clear for the most part...I only had to make a few phone calls.
quote...."I got the impression you ordered the wiring kit from Francis that was specific to your year of engine in that it is a standard kit with no deletions? correct Sounds like the instructions are very detailed as well. To be clear, the tranny harness comes with the engine harness, correct?" correct
his engine is OBD II so the kit will be different[101 computer wires on his,60 on yours]will need to reprogram the computer to delete stuff
update: here are pictures of my test fit of my intake system. also looks like if i shorten my battery box to 12 inches it will clear the engine and i can leave it in the stock location.
had to post one more time. post 600 wow that only took about 2 months
600...congrats...and keep them coming! The car's coming along nicely. LOL...remember our discusion, way back when, when we were wondering (I was wondering) why the California guy had so many hours getting it done?
My harness had 95 wires to the panel from the engine and tranny...I counted!...and that did not include the wires to and from other places to the panel.
update: put in a different transmission dipstick[out of a 96 f150 modifyed to fit]the mark VIII one would have been under my heater hoses and hard to reach[look at the last picture on reply 110].also built a heat shield around the steering box,not sure if i need one,but it can't hurt.it is all the little stuff that seems to take forever to do
That dipstick mod really moves it's location quite a bit. I can see why with the oem heater box there it would be a definite problem. Good solution!
update:still waiting for a few parts [nobody stocks anything anymore].starting on taking my wiring harness apart
update:sorted out my temp gauge and sender,my tests are saying a sender for a 67 mustang will work[i hope]test fitted the computer mount bracket,the mark VIII one will work.picked the spot where the computer wiring will come threw the firewall[still need to drill].i am going to use the under hood fuse panel from the mark,did some test fitting,looks like the best place will be close to the spot where the voltage reg went.
do you know how many wires there are in a harness?still working on taking it apart.
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2015-05-07 21:16
do you know how many wires there are in a harness?still working on taking it apart.
A gagillion! That's why the car weighs over 4000lbs. It has more copper in it than steel! I did a Continental (5.0 speed density) for my 66 Falcon Ranchero swap and had a butt load of wire left over after all the "junk" was out of the harness.
I can't even begin to imagine the work to take the oem harness apart and keep everything sorted out. Even with all the necessary schematics, it's got to be a nighmare just trying to figure out what is what.The idea of a paint by numbers kit like I used is high dollar, but has got to start looking more appealing at some point in your effort, I would think. My kudos to you for taking on the challenge...I know you'll get it done, something I could never do.
update:test fitted the computer and under dash computer wiring
update:first picture is the test fit of the coil on plug wiring fitted the the engine harness[needs to be finished]second is the part of the underhood harnass that i am using.the 3rd picture is the part that i cut out and am not using
update:still working on the wiring.first picture is of the books you will find handy when doing this project.second picture is the wiring i kept from the wiring from inside the mark VIII.the last picture is of the wiring that is left over from the mark VIII.
wow.....even after disassembling two Mark viii's I'm still surprised at the quantity of wiring. But I never attempted to remove the wiring other than the engine harness. The good news side of it is the almost nonexistance of vacumn lines on these cars due to everything being electrical.
update:first and second pictures,you can see my coil on plug wiring and my power steering test fit.needed to test fit booster/power steering to see how much room i have for the under hood fuse panel.last picture,"wiring is sure fun" LOL
The cop conversion.....are you reprograming the computer to actually put out 8 signals, or are you doing the "simulated" conversion, like I'm doing, using the stock signalling actually putting out 4 signals, each to two coils? Not having those coil packs sure increases your upfront room. Hopefully my coils will be in before too long....snail mail from Maine to Texas!!
Is the PS reservoir being moved to the inner fender well, or is it just there temporarily out of the way?
i have done the"simulated" conversion on the coils.yes,the p/s reservoir is from a 2004 ranger,the picture shows where it is going to be mounted
here is another picture of the p/s reservoir,it also shows the hight and spot i am mounting the fuse panel.you can see just in front and below the p/s reservoir where i will be mounting the cruse control.looks like i will have room for the original washer bag
I just noticed your top radiator inlet is on the driver's side. I'm pretty sure I saw a coolant pipe on one of the dohc versions where the pipe exited the left side..maybe a fwd Continental?
i have one of those coolant pipes,when i get to that point,i will see what one will work better
update:got the transmission wired up.was able to use the factory plug on the left side of the trans tunnel to bring the wires inside the car
here is a picture of where the trans wiring comes inside the car.the next picture is the auto shift linkage.it is stock 57,the only change is at the lever at the trans[front half 57 back half 2001]
I just noticed the "cup"-like extension? sitting on your throttle body intake. Tell me what you've got there..something from a different car? I don't recall seeing one like that on any of the MKVIII's I've looked at, and not too many other version 4.6's have the oval shape.
it is the connector hose from after market cold air systems.a 4 inch hose fits the throttle body.this one is 4 inch on one side and 4 1/2 on the other and is 3 inch long.the one i picked up is made by vibrant performance part number vib 2837. look at reply 136 [first picture]and reply 122
update:first picture is of the final install of my booster,next one is of my heater box heater hose install,next 2 are of my front fuel line install.this is the front fuel hose out of the lincoln mark and fits good.also rich muise the last picture shows a close up of the connector hose on the throttle body.i was going to install my heater motor but i need a 3 wire motor and the replacement one on the car is a 2 wire.out parts hunting again :005:
Looking good Gary. I assume you're looking for a heater motor from something other than a '57 that'll work.?
I had also kept the forward fuel lines from the donor car...just ended up not using them.
I checked out and saved the Vibrant performance website. Some good stuff on there, including some SS radiator clamps I've been looking for. I'm assuming you went with a 4 x 4 1/2 silicon adapter because the intake tube you're using in 4 1/2? I'm assuming this because you mentioned a 4" flexible tube would fit the MKVIII throttle body, so if my intake tube was 4" I could just go with their 4" x 4". I don't need it for my current setup, but eventually I want to make an intake plenum that will sit over the engine, like in the pic of this really sanitary f-100. I'm 90% sure at this point the maf sensor will fit under the '57 hood in the position shown on the truck.
PS...for some reason, the pic opens up weird when you click on it, but after it expands, click on "open with.... Paint" up top and it'll come up normal !?
i am going to try a resister on the 2 wire motor,should be able to get 2 speeds.the intake tube elbow is 4 1/2 od.neet looking intake,but that looks too high for a 57
i used a ignition resistor [mopar]wired into low speed side of the heater switch.runs about 1/2 speed on low
update:the under hood wiring is as far as i can go before i put the front sheet metal on.pulling the fuel tank to replace the sending unit and to finish the back fuel lines,using a new plastic line for the supply and the stock fuel line for the return.will post pictures when i get them done
I sent you a PM with a couple of questions before I saw this post I can't wait to see the next set of pictures
when i pulled the tank i saw that the spare tire well needs repair.another to do when it is apart
has anyone lowered the spare tire well for extra tire clearance?looks like i can lower it about 3/4 to 1 inch at the back part of the well,that will let my 215 75 14 tire fit.
Just for info...that pic I posted of the pickup with the really clean engine compartment....before I put the second fender on, I laid my air cleaner/maf housing/connector elbow on top of the intake and alternator and closed the hood. Just eyeballing, but there is at least 1 1/2" clearance.
found a good spare tire well,just need to get time to go get it and get it installed
Gary...any updates??
it is hard to get projects worked on in the summer time.i did find some new coil covers i picked up from ford
Covers look good....
I've been forgetting to ask...is your engine off centered just a bit??...a little closer to the passenger side control arm than the driver's side? Everything on mine was 3/8 off center.
my engine is to the pass side about a 1/16 of a inch
Gary...been meaning to ask...do you forsee any issues with pinion angle on our drivetrains?
update:i have decided to put in a/c.hoping to use the dealer installed polor air under dash unit from 1957/58,adapting it to the mark 8 compresser.looking for a bigger/higher capacity radiator that is not $500 bucks.also looking for a trailer hitch that will fit the wagon.the trailer i have has a tongue weight of 300 lbs,think i will need to add a leaf to the back springs
I installed the Mark IV under dash unit available from Vintage Air in my Ranchero. Period correct looks, great cooling and all new self contained components (blower, expansion valve, evaporator and controls). Installed with a bulk head fitting on the firewall for the AC hoses. Nice neat installation.
Gary not to hijack but if you find a hitch please let me know where you found one.
finally things have slowed down at home.time has come to start working on my wagon again,i found a washer bottle i think will work good.came from a late 90" taurus
Quote from: Raven Rider on 2015-10-02 17:47
Gary not to hijack but if you find a hitch please let me know where you found one.
i found a universal one for a 1 ton truck with a service box that will fit with some trimming.
i have been down with the flu for almost 2 months,hope to get back to the project in january
Hey Gary, good to hear from you. I was wondering what happened to you. 2 months is a long time, but sounds like you're on the recovery track. Just watch your health...getting a big shop warmed up in the Canadian winters can't be easy. Do you have a smaller, close off area, in your new shop that is easier to heat?
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-01-06 09:19
Hey Gary, good to hear from you. I was wondering what happened to you. 2 months is a long time, but sounds like you're on the recovery track. Just watch your health...getting a big shop warmed up in the Canadian winters can't be easy. Do you have a smaller, close off area, in your new shop that is easier to heat?
you need to insulate well[15-18in of insulation in my ceilings].i leave the temperature at about 40f so nothing freezes,only warming it up when i work in the shop and have no problems heating the building
update:found my oil to air engine oil cooler will not fit,no room for the oil filter when i tryed to install the oil cooler adapter.found one off a 2000 crown vic police car,goes in the lower rad hose,looks like it will fit.having some trouble finding the a/c fittings i need.
Gary...if you're looking for springloc fittings I got mine and others at either www.coldhose.com or www.purechoicemotorsports.com
edit...I just checked...springlocs I got at cold hose
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-01-27 14:35
Gary...if you're looking for springloc fittings I got mine and others at either www.coldhose.com or www.purechoicemotorsports.com
edit...I just checked...springlocs I got at cold hose
because of the poor canadian doller,[something for $50 US will cost over $100 landed here] i am trying to find parts in canada
went to put on my oil cooler type oil filter adapter,was going to put on some sealant but the tube was empty.will get some more today
Ha...at least it was empty. I'm so slow at getting things done, most of the time stuff will harden in the tube before I get it anywhere near empty.
got my cooler on.2nd picture show my old hastings oil leak tester,works well for priming the engine before start up.3rd picture power steering and belt back on
This is the first time I've seen the cooler setup. I'm curious to see how everything is going to clear the radiator/lower hose connection. The cooler adapter sure puts the lower hose in a different place., although I can't remember where the oem lincoln outlet was...I got mine off a crown vic police unit as well, just didn't have the cooler.
I just went back and reread most of this thread. It's amazing how different our installs are, with almost every detail being handled differently.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-02-02 09:23
I just went back and reread most of this thread. It's amazing how different our installs are, with almost every detail being handled differently.
i think a lot has to do with what parts are available,your skill level,what you want when you are finished[i am pulling a trailer with the wagon].the oil cooler has the lower rad hose hooked to it and with the coolant going though it.my measurements say there is room for the cooler.next step is to fit the rad and then to clean up the front sheet metal,paint the inner splash pans and install the front end
update;here is a picture of my in progress rad install.still working on the top mounts
update;got my lower rad mounts welded in.starting to clean and paint the inner fenders and rad support.they do not list the round rubbers that go between the inner fenders and firewall.found model A [1928-1931]cowl shims are the same.$3.50 set of 6 :003:
I used round rubber washers and stainless washers from Lowe's. They both can be found in their hardware drawers. Seem like they were 2" dia, but had larger and smaller. I alternated ss/rubber//ss, etc. until I got the thickness I needed. Used a slightly smaller dia. combo under the bolt head on the wheel side.
went too do some more welding...now the welder died :005: checked the welder out,has a bad trigger switch,off tomorrow to find parts
got the welder fixed,now back to the front end
Funny....my (purchasedin 1995) Daytona Mig started being bad, figured it would cost half as much as the purchase price to fix so I did some research. Settled on a Miller 141 or a Miller 211. Talking at breakfast (normal Sat morning group) turns out one of the guys (a good friend) was looking to upgrade from his Miller 211 and it turned into my new welder. Love it!
Running out of gas and wire are on my list of things that push me over the edge! Equipment failure is a real close second!
all painted up,almost ready for install....now where are those special bolts i bought???
there has been so much discussion on this ride height/spring issue i decided to put the tires on and see were it would sit.i know the front end is not on and there is more weight to be put on.right now with it on the ground the springs did not compress at all.the upper control arm bumpers are still compressed into the frame.if i stand on the frame were the rad support goes [over 200 lbs] it is still on the bumpers.if i jump up and down on the frame,it moves down about a inch then back on the bumpers.i do not think these spring[they are almost 60 year old used springs] are going to compress enough even with the weight on.i am thinking of putting in the original 6 cyl springs before i put the front end on.what do you guys think?here are some pictures.the springs in right now are .717 in diameter and about 16 inch long,8 active coils.so almost the same as rich's springs [see the correct spring spex in my next post]
Sounds like the same problem I had. Your springs are even heavier though...mine had a wire size of .700. Wish I had an answer for you, but I'll find out Monday if my friend can swap the coils again, either Monday or Tuesday, but I have a feeling it may be after our trip to Phoenix, so at least two weeks. I do have the too-high ones I had in there cut and ready to go back in.
i pulled out the left spring.it is 17.25 long, 1.165 between coils,5.5 OD,.712 wire size,8.5 active coils.these springs came out of a 57 ranchero,but must be from something else.maybe one of you math persons can calculate the spex on these springs.i took a picture of this spring and a stock one out of my wagon just to compare the two.
Lynn can do that!!!, lol. That's a heck of a spring that was in the Ranchero...was that the one you sold a few years ago? Any idea what the ride height was in the donor car? My guess is the old springs will work a whole lot better.
the tall springs came out of a parts ranchero,had no motor when i got it so do not know what hight it was
You betcha! I wake up every morning looking for a good equation.. :003:
Based on your numbers I calculated a spring rate of 365 lbs/inch for the tall spring. I did count 9 active coils from the picture though so I used that.
If I use the load we used for Rich's car.... (Front corner weight of 896 lbs, and a spring load of 1900 lbs) that spring will have an installed compressed length of 12" compared to a factory spec of 9.6" That puts the ride height at 5" above stock!!!!! In other words the suspension won't even compress under static weight.
Where do you want the ride height to be? What spindles are you using?
i am using granada/lincoln spindles.looking for more of a stock ride height.if i worked the numbers right from your post you put under rich's build,it looks like the original 6 cyl springs will be close.they are the b7a-e spring 13.75 free height,9.6 load ,2025 load lbs,500 lbs/in.maybe if i ask nice you can run the numbers also.thanks for now
Out of curiosity I ran the comparison of your 215/75/14 tires against my (newly changed size) tires of 215/70/15. Because of your 75 sidewall height, your 14" tire dia only comes up .150 difference, so your 14's will only be a lower ground clearance of .075 than mine.
I'm curious if the 215 wide tires on yours hits the hd sway bar at full lock....I'm guessing since your turning radius isn't limited like the R & P it does hit.??
the tires clear by about a 1/4 inch.when the car is at ride height,i should have a little more clearance
No problem... If we assume your car's weight applies a 1900 lb spring load compared to the original 2025 lbs, that means that instead of the spring compressing to the 9.6" stock length, it will compress to 9.85" That will raise the car by only 1/2" over stock.
The numbers you gave me for the spring are a little off. The 500 lb/in spring will compress 4.05" giving a compressed height of 9.7".
What is the spindle drop on tthe Grenadas?
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-02-21 09:42
Out of curiosity I ran the comparison of your 215/75/14 tires against my (newly changed size) tires of 215/70/15. Because of your 75 sidewall height, your 14" tire dia only comes up .150 difference, so your 14's will only be a lower ground clearance of .075 than mine.
I'm curious if the 215 wide tires on yours hits the hd sway bar at full lock....I'm guessing since your turning radius isn't limited like the R & P it does hit.??
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-02-21 09:50
the tires clear by about a 1/4 inch.when the car is at ride height,i should have a little more clearance
My tires dont even come close to my swaybar????
Quote from: lalessi1 on 2016-02-21 09:52
No problem... If we assume your car's weight applies a 1900 lb spring load compared to the original 2025 lbs, that means that instead of the spring compressing to the 9.6" stock length, it will compress to 9.85" That will raise the car by only 1/2" over stock.
The numbers you gave me for the spring are a little off. The 500 lb/in spring will compress 4.05" giving a compressed height of 9.7".
What is the spindle drop on tthe Grenadas?
some people say a 2.5 drop,some say less,so i am not sure.the spring numbers came from the aug 1958 ford service letters
Quote from: lalessi1 on 2016-02-21 09:54
My tires dont even come close to my swaybar????
the borgoson box and the granada spindles have more turning radius than stock
The numbers I am looking at are in the 1957 Ford Shop Manual...close enough.
Basically, if I understand correctly, you would like a spring that would raise your car 2-2 1/2" overstock?
If so, I would consider cutting the long spring. If you cut 1 coil... you would have a spring with approximately 15 3/8" free length. The spring rate would go up to 411 lbs per inch, the installed compressed length would be 10.75" and the car would sit about (10.75 - 9.6) x 2.12 or 2.4 inches higher than stock.
I would suggest measuring the spring to a 15 3/8" free height and cut it there as a starting point.
PS, not to be an alarmist but I would wait and see how Rich's car compares to the numbers after he gets his springs installed. All good designs verify numbers with prototypes. :002:
Quote from: lalessi1 on 2016-02-21 11:08
The numbers I am looking at are in the 1957 Ford Shop Manual...close enough.
Basically, if I understand correctly, you would like a spring that would raise your car 2-2 1/2" overstock?
If so, I would consider cutting the long spring. If you cut 1 coil... you would have a spring with approximately 15 3/8" free length. The spring rate would go up to 411 lbs per inch, the installed compressed length would be 10.75" and the car would sit about (10.75 - 9.6) x 2.12 or 2.4 inches higher than stock.
I would suggest measuring the spring to a 15 3/8" free height and cut it there as a starting point.
PS, not to be an alarmist but I would wait and see how Rich's car compares to the numbers after he gets his springs installed. All good designs verify numbers with prototypes. :002:
i had not considered cutting the long spring,good idea.yes i agree with you on waiting for rich.now his engine is back more than mine,somethink else to think about
Other stuff which may or may not change things....
I may be wrong, but I thought Lincolns were a little different than Granadas. I thought the Lincolns only dropped 1 1/2, and the Granadas could be reamed for 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 drops. In a previous discussion, I thought we had determined because of the way your spindles sat high on the ball joints like mine, they were Granadas reamed for the 2 1/2 drop. I think what Lynn is asking/trying to verify...you went to the dropped spindles (to get the disc brake setup), but want to overide that change to get it back to stock height?
I'm kinda thinking the lighter weight of the drivetrain, with the stock springs, might get you not to far from that, if that's in fact what you want.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-02-21 12:23
Other stuff which may or may not change things....
I may be wrong, but I thought Lincolns were a little different than Granadas. I thought the Lincolns only dropped 1 1/2, and the Granadas could be reamed for 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 drops. In a previous discussion, I thought we had determined because of the way your spindles sat high on the ball joints like mine, they were Granadas reamed for the 2 1/2 drop. I think what Lynn is asking/trying to verify...you went to the dropped spindles (to get the disc brake setup), but want to overide that change to get it back to stock height?
I'm kinda thinking the lighter weight of the drivetrain, with the stock springs, might get you not to far from that, if that's in fact what you want.
the lincoln spindles do not need to be reamed,they have the correct size hole,so they are as ford made them.i do not know how much drop the lincoln spindles will give me.because i want to pull a trailer i think a more stock ride height will work better.want to see how your cut springs work out.still not sure what way to go with my springs
I would probably take a different approach, which of course would require more work then trying to calculate the math. There are just too many variables with modified suspension, engine weights and locations. I would install the stock springs and wait until all the sheet metal, bumpers etc etc are installed. That will give you a know reference point and you can work from there. Yes, it's more work changing the springs afterwards, I know I need to add a spacer in mine but I have been to lazy to pull it apart again :003:
Exactly what I'd normally suggest, but for Gary, he's got a very similar setup to be able to compare to...something I didn't have. We both have the dropped spindles and the same drivetrain, so whatever ends up working for me, he should be able to take some direct references from....of course he does have the lift to make life a bit easier should he decide to wait, lol.
Yes Rich they are similar but not the same, different spindles and he wants closer to a stock ride height from what I gather. I don't think there is any simple answer, each persons car and mods are different and looking for different final results, rake vs stock etc. I think the only way is trial and error unfortunately, and hope you are lucky and hit it right the first time. I only wish I had a lift too, floor jack and stands gets old for me.
Looks like tommorrow is the day for my coil spring swap getting done, so I (we) won't have to wait two weeks to find out if plan 3 works.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-02-22 14:46
Looks like tommorrow is the day for my coil spring swap getting done, so I (we) won't have to wait two weeks to find out if plan 3 works.
Hopefully this time will be the charm. I've been driving two years on plan 1 and I hit a tire stop in the parking lot with the sway bar this morning :005: I just don't park in lots often enough to remember or it's just old brain fade :003:
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-02-22 14:46
Looks like tommorrow is the day for my coil spring swap getting done, so I (we) won't have to wait two weeks to find out if plan 3 works.
i think i will put the stock springs in for now,but will wait to see how rich's springs work before i put the springs in [about a 1/2 hour job with the front end off]
Gary...I'll try to post some more info/pics later,but I'm really happy with where the ride height is now..just a tad higher than perfect, but I suspect it may settle 1/2" or so, and be exactly where I wanted to be from the start.
i am going to put the stock spring in with a 1/4 spacer,finish putting the car back together and see were it sits.if it is not right i will try cut the other springs
A spacer will raise the car by about 2.12 times the thickness of the spacer.
so i put in the original 6cyl springs with a 1/4 spacer [it is hard rubber may compress some]. with a extra 225 lbs on the front frame where the rad support goes.here are the numbers i came up with[some numbers are a estimate]front of rocker to ground 8 inch.front bumper to ground 10-11 inch.lower control arm bumper to frame 2 inch.bottom of sway bar to ground is 7 inch.i have 215-75-14 inch tires. now i jumped up and down on the front frame and could not get the lower control arm bumper to bottom out.so how do these numbers compare to other peoples cars?
Bottom of bumper to ground 9 3/4" , rocker to ground 6 1/2", lower bump stop to frame, less than 3/4", swaybar to ground 5". Aerostar springs, no spacer (Moog), stock spindles, 225/60 x 15 tires. TOO LOW.
PS...I really like the centerline of spindle axle to fender lip measurement as way to get accurate comparison numbers as it eliminates a lot of variables.
Quote from: lalessi1 on 2016-02-25 11:05
Bottom of bumper to ground 9 3/4" , rocker to ground 6 1/2", lower bump stop to frame, less than 3/4", swaybar to ground 5". Aerostar springs, no spacer (Moog), stock spindles, 225/60 x 15 tires. TOO LOW.
PS...I really like the centerline of spindle axle to fender lip measurement as way to get accurate comparison numbers as it eliminates a lot of variables.
i am hoping to get the fenders on this weekend.then i can get the spindle measurement[hard to do with no fenders]
got the front end on,set some of the parts in the engine compartment [rad ect.]then i put another 80 lbs on the front.so i should be close to the height.here are some of the numbers.centerline of spindle axle to fender lip is 13 inch,sway bar to ground 6 3/4,front rocker to ground 7 3/4,lower control arm bumper to frame 2 1/4
Sounds good to me...that 13" is what I was shooting for and hoping will eventually settle to there.
I agree, those numbers sound a lot better than mine. Dropped spindles are the ticket.
update;working on getting the rad and fan in and found the engine oil cooler will not fit.will need to change the part that the rad hose goes though to a oil to air one that will mount in front of the rad.was able to fit a 65 mustang battery box[will post pictures]gives me about a inch clearance between the battery and the valve cover
Heck, an inch ain't nothing, unless it's on the end of your axel :)
update;the first picture is of my modified 65 mustang battery box,second is with the box in the car,you can see it clears the valve cover enough to work.3rd is of the water manifold i used[98 lincoln continental]does not have a spot for the temp gauge sender,remote mounted mine in the heater hose. 4th is of the coolers install and horn relocation.still need to clean and paint the cooler brackets
The Continental water pipes work nice for a radiator with the outlet on driver's side!, but what is the tapped hole in the passenger side of that pipe if not for a sender?
The battery tray worked out great. There is a sender on the back heater hose pipes...is that what you used? I think you were the one that told me Lincoln used it for the climate control? I'm trying to remember...does the computer require it's own water temp sender? I'm thinking I installed two.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-03-17 00:31
The Continental water pipes work nice for a radiator with the outlet on driver's side!, but what is the tapped hole in the passenger side of that pipe if not for a sender?
The battery tray worked out great. There is a sender on the back heater hose pipes...is that what you used? I think you were the one that told me Lincoln used it for the climate control? I'm trying to remember...does the computer require it's own water temp sender? I'm thinking I installed two.
the tapped hole is for the computer temp sender,the one i put in the heater hose is for the dash temp gauge. you can see that in picture #3.i see i made 700 posts :003:
you know when you test fit parts,they should just bolt back in on final install,right?well i have been spending most of my time adjusting,modifying,changing parts to make them fit.i will give a sample of what i am saying.did the final install on the rad/fan assembly, it cleared the rad support on test fit now it hits/rubs.so out it has to come again :005:
Frustrating isn't it??...but I have a solution...don't test fit. once they're on, leave em'!
got all the parts/hoses/fuse panel test fitted/installed on the left inner fender.was getting ready for the final clean/paint/install on these things.then realized that i had forgot the cruse control servo.now in the process of rearranging things to make room for the servo. 2 steps ahead,4 back :005:
here are some progress pictures.alot of this stuff still needs to come off for clean/paint.picture #1 almost done test fitting most parts.#2 left side after my redo to fit the cruse servo.#3 this is the spot i found for the cruse servo.#4 checking battery fit[not correct mustang battery,but will work for test],fitting air cleaner ducting,rad overflow and a/c parts.#5 shows where i put the air filter and that i had to put in a shorter fan motor to get things to fit.also my mass air should clear the hood[will know when i put the hood on]
here is picture #5
Kinda like eating an elephant, isn't it? You're gonna like it when it's done, trust me. Got on mine hard today for just a short burst...turned on a highway, and nailed it at about 40 going uphill, but not full on throttle...got to 80 in no time and it was pretty obvious I didn't have an air intake problem I thought maybe I had. That is with the car still in back up mode. Thanks for the updates, Gary. I'm enjoying watching this come together.
busy trying to stuff 12 inches of parts into a 10 inch hole
update;under hood wiring is 90% done,p/s plumbing is done,found that i could not buy a 24f group battery [could order one from a mustang shop,but was pricey]with the side ears for mounting to the 65 mustang battery box.so i modifyed the box to fit a readily available battery with the side mounts[fits late model gm trucks]790 cca,waiting for a/c fitting that will run under the battery box so can not install battery box yet.oil cooler plumbing about 1/2 done.air filter and piping installed.if i was retired like some of you guys i would have a lot more time to work on this.working and raising grand kids eats up a lot of my time
It's a trade-off, lol. By the time you get to retire, you probably have slowed waaaay down, so you don't get any more done than when you were younger and still working.
Sounds like progress though.
update;both oil coolers hooked up,some more under hood wiring done.a/c fittings should be here friday
Were you able to locate some fittings north side of the border as you were hoping?
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-04-20 18:26
Were you able to locate some fittings north side of the border as you were hoping?
one of the hydraulic hose shops in town does a/c hoses.i needed some less common hose fittings so they needed to order them
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-04-17 09:37
if i was retired like some of you guys i would have a lot more time to work on this.
Had to smile a little....having been where you are now and now being retired and free of time eaters I found there is a new gremlin to get in the way of projects.......it is the feared and loathed "ROUND TUIT". As you come to realise there is no need to hurry because of work or ball games the ol I'll get around to it tomoorow slowly creeps in and pretty soon the pile of "ROUND TUITS" is a mountian!
Now having said that, the joy of only having one obligation every morning (getting up and making the coffee) is pretty nice.
my a/c fittings came in today.two were wrong. :005:it seems like the gods do not want me to finish this project
If those are the springlock fittings for the compressor, I not only ordered the wrong size on one of the lines, but when I reordered, I ordered the same wrong size again!!
to get the a/c service ports into a spot where you can access to them under the battery box,i will need to custom make the fittings with the service ports.under hood wiring about 98% done.installed a wiper switch with the washer switch built in,needed to modify the dash backing plate the knob and the switch mounting bezel[took about 3 hours ] off to the parts places on monday to see what i can find for a/c stuff
If you have a log time established A/C shop nearby, they usually have a pretty good supply of fittings.
checked 3 different a/c fitting supplyers,looked in there catalogs.no one makes the fittings i need.what i will do is cut apart 3 fittings put them together then have the a/c shop silver solder them together.
Just a thought...
www.coldhose.com
BTW, I checked their site and they are now making a compressor block that is usable on our Mark VIII compressors because they do not have the built in 90* elbows which are headed in the wrong direction. Wish they had that when I plumbed mine up, and I wouldn't have had to go the rubber hose route on those two lines.
got my custom a/c fittings made up used 3 fittings and silver soldered them together.cost me $100 for each one
here are some pictures;first one is of $200 in a/c fittings,2nd you can see with these fittings i can access the service ports under the battery box,3rd my 57 dealer installed polorair unit[needs assembly]and the wiring still to do,4th is of my wiper switch install and the o/d cancel switch i put in the old choke spot
some more progress pictures
update;trying to put as much time into this project as i can.i am about 95% done under the hood.picture 1 is of a/c lines and my rad,hose install.#2 upper rad hoses.#3 overall picture.
here are some battery install pictures.i am pleased at how the bigger battery fit the modifyed 65 mustang battery box and how it clears the engine
I somehow even missed the pics you posted on the 29th. Wow, you're moving right along on the project. I'm surprised at the battery fitment...you made that work quite nicely....and the A/C fittings as well.
The unit in front of the radiator with the blue hoses...is that the oil cooler you were talking about? I assume the tranny cooler lines are in the radiator?, and is that radiator from the Mark VIII donor car? The smaller cooler in front of the condenser...is that the P/S cooler?
The red canister with the white cap and the ss band...washer reservoir?
I'm still amazed at how two guys can come up with so many differences on basically the same build.
How long before you get to turn the key?
RICH;the unit with the blue hoses is the engine oil cooler.the trans cooler is the cooler on the passenger side[smaller one].the rad is a aftermarket aluminum one.the steel tube/pipe under the coolers going side to side is the power steering cooler[see post 219,last picture].the red canister is my water/alcohol injection system.if you look beside the master cylinder,you will see the cap for my washer bottle.under dash wiring to do still,fuel pump/lines to do.need to fix the spare tire well so i can install the fuel tank.finish back brakes.exhaust to finish.so still some more work to do
update;finished installing my heater,installed the radio and the clock took both of these apart to paint the orange hands/indicators.cleaned and lubed the clock,seems to work.the radio is a town and country unit that has a chip in it so it has am/fm and ipod connecter. working on hooking up the wiring under the dash.had a custom speedo cable made up and installed that[needed the speed sensor]
Who did your radio? Are you happy with it?
a place called carola radio in edmonton supplied and repaired/chiped the radio.he specializes in antique car and home radios.i just put the radio in so i have not tryed it yet
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-05-20 18:10
update;finished installing my heater,installed the radio and the clock took both of these apart to paint the orange hands/indicators.cleaned and lubed the clock,seems to work.the radio is a town and country unit that has a chip in it so it has am/fm and ipod connecter. working on hooking up the wiring under the dash.had a custom speedo cable made up and installed that[needed the speed sensor]
Remember that the I-pod aux connector on your Town and Country will also traffic a Sirius Radio set-up in your car, ain't nothing better than that, mine is, as you know, hidden in the cubby hole and the satellite antenna is mounted on the back dash. I can give you a hand putting that in if you like. :) Looking amazing there Mr. Hoven!
Just to let you guys know how small the world is, especially when it comes to 57 Fords, come to find out Canadian_Ranchero bought this wagon off my Ma's neighbour. LOL
update;i have the under dash wiring about 3/4 done.summer is almost here,harder to get time to work on this project.like i said before if i had time like you retired guys i would be finished by now
hooked up the battery to test some of the wiring.NO SMOKE :003:thats a good thing
That IS a good thing.
Getting closer to that grin on your face when the engine fires up!!
heard this ticking noise when i hooked up the battery.checked it out.it was the clock :003:
HaHa...I did the same thing. Made sure everything was off when I hooked up the battery, but could hear a clicking noise.....turned out to be the hazard lights I didn't think about being on.
Your hearing is way better than mine...then remembered my clock was upgraded to quartz and makes no sound!!!
spent over a days time trying to repair/rebuild a 59 signal light switch[had 2 switches]got one to work about 90% of the time,not good enough.too bad 57 switches will not fit,i have 3 good ones.found a 3rd switch from a 59[good thing i know someone that has some 59 parts],must have been replaced at one time because of the better/different design than the other 2 i had.was able to repair/rebuild this one and got it installed,put it in the car and it did not work. found the 59 wiring colors a little different and then the flasher desided not to work.this project took almost 2 weeks by it self to get done.need to change out my oil presser sender,put one in for a gauge by mistake[the newer types almost look the same] .under dash wiring about 80% done.3 steps ahead and 4 back :005:
had a good day today.underdash wiring about 90% done.installed the computer,check engine light works,the o/d light works,tested the radio am/fm/ipod all seem to work[had my granddaughter test the ipod]i hooked up the back up lights to work all the time[the factory has them hooked up so you need your lights on].the engine turns over[no gas tank yet]here are some pictures,first one you can see my 59 turn signal switch,my cruse switches,you can see the ipod connecter out of the glove box.2nd picture you can see where i put my check engine light :003:
got the oil presser senser/switch changed now the oil light works.not sure if you guys noticed but i used the 59 steering coluum to dash mount and the 59 signal light wire cover
"The engine turns over".....that's the biggie in that list. Congrats on the progress. Looking good.
update;got the wiper/washer finished up.used 66 mustang washer nozzles.finished up my under dash gauge set up.bigger red light above the gauges[on dash]is hooked to the low brake fluid sensor in the mustang master cylinder.the small warning light beside the tach is hooked to the low washer fluid sensor in the washer bottle.the toggle switch between the tach and the trans temp gauge is to switch between coolers,move the switch left and it reads the engine oil temp,move it right and it reads the trans temp.here are some pictures.if you look to the left in the last picture you can see where i put the computer beside the steering coluum
That's some pretty cool stuff you've got going on there, Gary.
update;have the spare tire well rust repair about 3/4 done.used a trailer fender, cut it up to fit.when you are tack welding parts together do not wear a short sleeve shirt,ask me how i know.i put the gas tank straps and bolts in a special place so i would not lose them.....found the straps.....still looking for the bolts :005:
That all sounds normal to me.
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-06-26 23:48
...when you are tack welding parts together do not wear a short sleeve shirt,ask me how i know... :005:
...shorts and sandals make the list too....
LOL Thats funny Gary, welding gloves up to the elbow and let the rest burn! Hey, you wouldn't be wanting to part with that nasty old radiator off the wagon would you? Just developed a leak on my top seam. Is yours in sellable shape? Your work looks awesome by the way, sure looking forward to hear that thing roar.
Quote from: gasman826 on 2016-06-27 17:47
...shorts and sandals make the list too....
and wedding bands and watches!
Mine had a crack in the top tank. Long gone...gave it to a guy who just crashed his and was patching it up. I bought one of those cheap, eBay aluminum radiators a couple of years ago. So far, so good....
Rings!!!!!!!!!! Those stay on no matter the reason...wife said so!!!! I don't turn on the welder without gauntlet gloves and welding jacket. Under car welding dictates a dew rag over the ears. Not much hair on top of my head and I just hate the sound of ear wax burning!!
Quote from: Lucky'57 on 2016-06-27 20:02
LOL Thats funny Gary, welding gloves up to the elbow and let the rest burn! Hey, you wouldn't be wanting to part with that nasty old radiator off the wagon would you? Just developed a leak on my top seam. Is yours in sellable shape? Your work looks awesome by the way, sure looking forward to hear that thing roar.
the good,the original rad is in good shape with no leaks.the bad,it is a 6 cyl rad,a hole bunch different than the v/8 one.you are welcome to come look if you want,just call
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-06-20 22:27
update;got the wiper/washer finished up.used 66 mustang washer nozzles.finished up my under dash gauge set up.bigger red light above the gauges[on dash]is hooked to the low brake fluid sensor in the mustang master cylinder.the small warning light beside the tach is hooked to the low washer fluid sensor in the washer bottle.the toggle switch between the tach and the trans temp gauge is to switch between coolers,move the switch left and it reads the engine oil temp,move it right and it reads the trans temp.here are some pictures.if you look to the left in the last picture you can see where i put the computer beside the steering coluum
Canadian Ranchero.........I really like your dual temp gauge set up. I'd like to ask the details of the wiring to use one gauge and two senders. I understand the two senders. Please walk me through the wiring through the toggle switch. Are the senders single wire or dual wire senders? What exactly is the toggle switch......number of poles? Number of "Throws"? And how is it wired. I think I know, but you know for sure how it is done.
Thanking you in advance!
John
Quote from: KYBlueOval on 2016-06-28 20:40
Canadian Ranchero.........I really like your dual temp gauge set up. I'd like to ask the details of the wiring to use one gauge and two senders. I understand the two senders. Please walk me through the wiring through the toggle switch. Are the senders single wire or dual wire senders? What exactly is the toggle switch......number of poles? Number of "Throws"? And how is it wired. I think I know, but you know for sure how it is done.
Thanking you in advance!
John
o/k i am using a b/m trans temp gauge,get a second matching sender [both senders are single wire].now the toggle switch is a on/off/on with 3 places to hook wires to.the center post is common.you hook the gauge sender wire to the center post and the wires from the senders,one goes to the left post and the other to the right post.hope this helps John.if you have anymore questions just let me know
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-06-28 21:49
o/k i am using a b/m trans temp gauge,get a second matching sender [both senders are single wire].now the toggle switch is a on/off/on with 3 places to hook wires to.the center post is common.you hook the gauge sender wire to the center post and the wires from the senders,one goes to the left post and the other to the right post.hope this helps John.if you have anymore questions just let me know
Thank you for the reply, I appreciate it.
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-06-28 21:49
o/k i am using a b/m trans temp gauge,get a second matching sender [both senders are single wire].now the toggle switch is a on/off/on with 3 places to hook wires to.the center post is common.you hook the gauge sender wire to the center post and the wires from the senders,one goes to the left post and the other to the right post.hope this helps John.if you have anymore questions just let me know
Well sir, I do have another question or two. I'm going to do this, I've decided that..........my question , having thought about this for a day or two is this...........where did you install the transmission temp sender? Is in one of the two cooling lines? If so, which one outbound or return? Or, is it installed in the transmission pan? I'm guessing the pan is the better location, but will look to your reply for the answer as to what location is best. IF,it is in the pan,is there a best location in the pan? Front Left.....Front Right? etc. I've done a little research regarding senders and the sizes ranges from 1/2 " NPT to 1/8 NPT. IF I'm correct that the pan is the best location, I'm thinking that the thing to do is weld in a 1/2NPT Bung in the transmission pan ( you'll tell me if there is a best location in the pan ). By using a 1/2 bung I can use any size sender on the market by bushing the bung down to whatever size the sender requires.
What have I missed or not considered? Like I said, I really like this idea and thank you for sharing it with all of us on the Forum.
John FYI......My Canadian ancestry dates back to 1647!
the b/m trans temp gauge kit comes with the parts to install the temp sender in the cooler lines.i put my sender in the line that goes back to the trans.this gives me the temp of the oil after the cooler.putting the sender in the trans pan gives you a more accurate temp reading of the trans oil.i do not know if there is a best spot to put the sender in the pan,but i would put the sender somewhere that would protect it from getting damaged/too hot.hope this helps
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-07-04 12:01
the b/m trans temp gauge kit comes with the parts to install the temp sender in the cooler lines.i put my sender in the line that goes back to the trans.this gives me the temp of the oil after the cooler.putting the sender in the trans pan gives you a more accurate temp reading of the trans oil.i do not know if there is a best spot to put the sender in the pan,but i would put the sender somewhere that would protect it from getting damaged/too hot.hope this helps
Thanks............you confirmed what i was thinking.
update;spare tire well still needs cleaning and painting.tryed to put anti freeze in and one of my hoses leaked.of course it is the one above the oil filter,i can almost see the hose...... :005:
update;got the coolant leak fixed,finished up the spare tire well,put a new sending unit in the gas tank[modifyed a non wagon one] .so a pretty good day
update;fuel tank is in[never did find the second strap bolt,had to make one],went with a different fuel pump prefilter making a new mount for that,finishing up the fuel pump wiring.grand kids as much as i love them,they can sure slow things down when they "help".when i put the car down on the ground i saw i had antifreeze on the ground again,turned out that some had got in the spring pocket when i was repairing the first leak.so no leak from the cooling system!!!!!!!! :003:
So, what's left to do before start-up? You've got to be getting close. Is the wiring done?
finish up fuel pump wiring/ lines and exhaust and a few other other things i am sure i will find/forgot and it should run.still need to finish the brakes,reinstall seats,grill, ect,
update;finished up the fuel pump wiring and line/pump install.here are some pictures
update;got things hooked up enough and will be trying to start the engine tomorrow.hope all goes well
Good luck bro!
Second that, few things are more exciting to me! :002:
will not fire up, :005: working on finding the problem
Is it cranking? The computer will shut the fuel pump down if the engine doesn't start within a few seconds. If the fuel lines were not bleed that could be the problem. I'm sure you know all that though.
update;i took the engine harness,coil packs and plug wires off a donor mark 8 installed it temporarily on the the 57 [put over top,layed coil packs on engine ect] and .....IT RUNS!!!!!!! :003: now i will have to see what is wrong with the engine harness i had on there that i had changed to coil on plug as i would like to keep the coil on plug system
Congrats!!! That's a huge milestone with the way to did all of the modified oem wiring. I'm really impressed, though had no doubts you'd pull it off. That had to be a great feeling after all that effort.
i think i may have found the problem.the sources i checked say you need to wire the coils in series,i wired mine in parallel.will hook some temporary jumper wires up and test this.will keep you posted.....
I'm curious if you did your cop conversion wiring the same as what I bought as a conversion harness. What I got was basically a harness that plugged into the connectors that would have plugged into the coil packs. The little harness add-on was of course prewired for the individual coils, basically just a plug in. Can't remember if I took pics of the conversion harness, but I'll look if it would be helpful.
i picked up a coil harness out of a 99 continental and tied it in to the mark 8 harness
This is a pic of the cop conversion harness I bought.....I know it doesn't help without knowing which wires went where. This harness just plugged into the coil pack connectors, so the 8 cop's are just running on the 4 signals sent to the coil packs
update;finishing up the coil harness changes,then the big test to see if it works.will keep you posted
had to post one more time...............800 posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
update;....IT RUNS!!!!!!! :003: changing the coil on plug wiring from parallel to series is what needed to be done.that took about a week to figure that out and fix the problem
lights....camera...action.!! Now, where did those dancing girls run off to?
update;finishing up my exhaust,needed to move my return fuel line to clear the 2 1/2 inch tail pipes.not alot of room for the 2 1/2 pipes,so it is being a challenge to get them to fit
watch the e brake cable clearance also.
update;other than a couple of clamps the exhaust is done.i needed to move my fuel pump over for more exhaust clearance.a little close to the left shock,but should work.i have some other places that are close to the fuel lines,but i put in heat shilds,so that will help.here are some pictures
here are some more pictures
Great pics...thanks for posting. Looks great. Did you buy one of those exhaust kits with a bunch of pre bent u shapes, etc.? Great setup you have in your garage....I'm assuming you won the lottery a few years ago, lol. What you did with the exhaust was what I had planned on doing until I realized how difficult it would have been for me without a lift. The underside of that wagon looks nice and solid.
Getting close to a drive?
i had got a flowmaster kit for my 65 mustang a few years ago,but found out it does not fit convertibles and they would not take it back.so i modified this kit to fit.the kit came with 40 series mufflers that are too loud,i put in 70 series. i am still paying for my garage,i wish i had won the lottery [one of the reasons i am still working].need to bleed brakes,put the interior back together,top up oil in the tranny ect,not that long of a list anymore.need to check the wheel alignment also
update;brakes are done.had one fitting leak at my residual check valve going to the back brakes.i had put it under the booster.i could see it,but not reach it.look at the picture to see what i did with this problem[from under the wheel well].the other picture is of my fuel filter heat shield and my trans pan drain plug protector.
it is not my day.now my heater core is leaking :005:
update;here is a picture of what is wrong with the heater core.one of the hose connections is eaten up so it did not seal.
i modified the heater box[drilled a new hole for the heater core hose connection]put in a heater core from a late 80's ford van.had to do the wheel well mod.again,to get to the bottom hose.here are some pictures
update;finished up the heater core install,got the tachometer working,installed the grill,found some issues with the signal lights,repaired that at the same time
put it down on the ground and drove it ahead about 6 feet.seems to run,stop and steer o/k.but the left tail pipe i thought would clear the shock does not,so i need to change that.still need to do a wheel alignment and some other small stuff[install seat,hood ect.].i am getting real close,maybe this weekend for a test drive.[if the stars align,gods in my favour].the exhaust sounds like a late model mustang :003:
Sure wish I could hear it. I'm not real happy with the Magnaflows I chose. They're allright most the time, but under a low load, like going up a hill on a freeway, it develops an obnoxious droan. Problem with trying to hear something on a computer...it ain't gonna happen accuratly. My goal was close to a late model Mustang, so I'll be anxious to hear what your thoughts are after you get to drive it for a while.
Rich:
You might have to try Borla or a Magnaflow set of mufflers to get the sound you want.
Bob
57 AGIN
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-08-29 07:12
Sure wish I could hear it. I'm not real happy with the Magnaflows I chose. They're allright most the time, but under a low load, like going up a hill on a freeway, it develops an obnoxious droan. Problem with trying to hear something on a computer...it ain't gonna happen accuratly. My goal was close to a late model Mustang, so I'll be anxious to hear what your thoughts are after you get to drive it for a while.
i went with 70 series flowmasters
I used the Borla ProXS, the longer ones and an x pipe. I love the sound, no droaning, quiet at highway speeds.
update;got my left hand exhaust pipe redone.here are some pictures.i am using a h pipe on my exhaust
canadian_ranchero:
Looks like very nice work and good thinking about avoiding heat on the fuel system.
Bob
57 AGIN
I often wondered why they ran the lines on the outside of the frame rail, could heat be the reason?
Quote from: Ford Blue blood on 2016-08-31 08:34
I often wondered why they ran the lines on the outside of the frame rail, could heat be the reason?
Good question. Maybe it would have been to hard to get around the trans cross member?
Some of the old sanctioned tech inspections didn't like fuel and brake lines on the inside of the frame in case of catastrophic part failure...driveshaft or transmission parts could cut the lines. I think the lines on the outside of the frame are vulnerable to collision damage.
I did muse over running the lines inside or outside the rails (both gas and brake needed replacement) and decided to go with the outside as they did from the factory. It was a real PITA with the body on but did get them in and tied down with the stock fasteners.
Not too worried about collision damage. If it is hit hard enough to get to them it would most likely hurt me pretty badly and brake line damage would be the least of my worries!
Quote from: Ford Blue blood on 2016-09-01 07:56
I did muse over running the lines inside or outside the rails (both gas and brake needed replacement) and decided to go with the outside as they did from the factory. It was a real PITA with the body on but did get them in and tied down with the stock fasteners.
Not too worried about collision damage. If it is hit hard enough to get to them it would most likely hurt me pretty badly and brake line damage would be the least of my worries!
i ran the new fuel line[high presser feed]on the inside of the right hand frame rail and used the original 6 cyl outside the frame rail one for the return line[also on the right side]
update;hood on,interior together,needed to swap all the guts from a 59 horn ring on to the 57 to get the horn to work properly.still need to set the alignment.then the test drive. :003: the first picture is of the clearance test for hood to mass air sensor,i have about 3/8 of a inch.the other is of the inside
update;you think you have all the leaks fixed,found a power steering leak and a brake line leak.i think i have them fixed.my front spring spacer bushings must have taken set.my center of hub to fender lip is now about 12 1/4-1/2 inch.i got the alignment set close enough to work.so if i do not run into any more problems i will be test driving tomorrow[if it does not rain]
Yahoo!...anxiously awaiting the first drive results. Interior is looking great. I don't remember you talking upholstery.....was it already done when you got the car?
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-09-06 09:10
Yahoo!...anxiously awaiting the first drive results. Interior is looking great. I don't remember you talking upholstery.....was it already done when you got the car?
i put in a new front rubber floor matt.the front seat and carpet was redone before i got the car,the rest of the interior is original
now the big news;i took about 6 test drives last night.i still have a small power steering leak and my posi diff is a little noisy.it sure is easy to go 80 mph.no shakes or vibrations at that speed.even the cruse control works.there are still a small list of little things to finish.here are some pictures of the wagon in the sun[been about 2 years] i put the hub caps on and cleaned the white walls after these were taken.i will need to repair the back springs,the left side is about 1 inch lower than the right
Congrats!!!! That is a good looking wagon...love the travel decals in the back. Nowadays all you can find are the vinyl stickers.
Your noisy posi, is it aftermarket? When I first had mine done, it was noisy, then I drained the synthetic oil out and put in the correct conventional oil with an addative...noise disappeared immediatly. Mine is a Yukon trac-loc.
Is your car throwing any codes? It sounds like your happy with the performance.?.!?
went to a car meet tonight in stony plain.longest trip so far.got me back home,that is a good thing.some people knew what engine it is, most did not.rich i put the additive in the posi[factory ford posi]90% of the noise is gone.so far the only code i am getting is a egr code,not surprised as i had deleted the egr.filled up the fuel tank today right to the top and the filler neck o-ring did not leak :003::003:the engine seems to be running better all the time[computer learning thing].the waterless coolant seems to work o/k,temp gauge runs at almost the top end of normal,does not get higher even in slow moving traffic
Are you still happy with the Flowmasters? For some reason, driving mine this week a few times after sitting for 2 months, the dronning sounds louder and at all speeds up to highway speed cruising where it finally quiets down. It doesn't seem to be just at higher load or too high of a gear anymore. LOL...maybe it's just that I've been driving it with no side glass. I don't mind a little loudness, just the real deep drone has gotta go...wish I was closer to you so we compare sound!
Rich & canadian_ranchero:
I'm thinking about possibly going to change from the Flowmasters to the Borla Mufflers. Borla's were installed on My Shelby GT by Shelby and I've always liked the way they sound on my 4.6 mod motor. But, I'm not sure how they would sound on my 57's 351W. You two might want to give them a thought for your 4.6's.
Bob
57 AGIN
Good to know what Brand the Shelby's used...they sure do sound great on the Shelby.
i have no drone,under cruse[70mph]it is quiet inside. is only noisy/rumbles when you put your foot on the gas.happy so far.i get more noise from the air filter than i do from the exhaust[need to insulate behind right kick panel].also the motor mounts must have settled, will need to make more space between the air intake and the firewall
Hi Gary. So good to hear the 57 is up and running. Tomorrow is Sunday, you should go to church! And, there's a car show. LOL Grace Point Church, 720 - 62nd St. Bonus, they feed you for free, you just gotta believe!
are you going?what time is it
went to a local cruse night[white oaks]last night.more than one person would just stop and stare when they got to the engine.had a small coolant leak[fixed now] everything else seems to work o/k.getting ready to take the wagon to radium car show in b.c.[about a 6 hour drive]leaving this friday. modified the fire wall for more air intake clearance,and i used 57 bird hubcaps[could be dealer installed on the wagons in 57]here are some pictures
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-09-10 18:31
are you going?what time is it
Yup! I figure all the girls will be getting out of church about 11:00, I'm gonna get a spot by the door round about 10:00. :) Hell hath no fury like a 57 Ford. Lord have mercy.
I went to the big Langley Good Times Cruise In , in Langley BC last Saturday. There was a couple of old Fords from Alberta, a red and black 56, and a dark blue and silver 57 Fairlane 500, with a 4.6L mod motor. The 57 also had an entire dashboard from a 2005ish Mustang in it, looked like a factory fit. While I was checking out the 57, a fellow came up and asked the owner if he had any trouble installing the Mustang dash, to which he replied, "Absolutely!!"
checked my engine codes;canister purge code[solenoid removed] ,egr code[did not install the egr valve] and a/c unpluged code.[unpluged till i get the a/c install finished].still have a small p/s fitting leak.everything else should be good enough to go to radium[i hope].will bring some tools and a few spare parts and off we will go friday morning.
My cannister purge solenoid is not hooked to anything...it's there, and wired, but just plugged on the vacumn hose fittings as I think it was you who suggested.
How is your tranny doing on hills in overdrive mode? Mine seems to want to shift in/out too often if I leave it in OD in hilly areas.
I forget what year your engine is, I think '96 so it's OBDII? mine is OBDI, '95
my engine is 95 [most of it],OBDI 93 mark 8 computer [no speed limiter]when i go to radium i will be driving in the mountains will be able to comment on tranny shifting when i get back
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-09-15 08:35
My cannister purge solenoid is not hooked to anything...it's there, and wired, but just plugged on the vacumn hose fittings as I think it was you who suggested.
How is your tranny doing on hills in overdrive mode? Mine seems to want to shift in/out too often if I leave it in OD in hilly areas.
I forget what year your engine is, I think '96 so it's OBDII? mine is OBDI, '95
just got back from radium.got me there and back.a few minor issues.lots of positive comments on my wagon/engine install.about the shifting,if anything i have the opposite problem wants to stay in o/d longer than i think it should
Congrats on the successful round-trip...it sure makes a guy feel good.
Actually I misspoke...mine also wants to stay in OD longer than it should. That's when the engine seems to be bogging down and the exhaust drone is at it's worst. I find I have to take my foot off the gas under that load to get the engine to stop loading down.
Speaking of exhaust...still happy with yours after the trip?
i think the problem is in the computer programming.the computer thinks it still has the 3.07 gears and 16 inch tires.mine still seems to pull the hills fine in o/d.i find if i push on the gas a little more it shifts to 3rd or in my case going through the mountains [national park]at 90km [55mph]speed limit i just turned the o/d off.i got about 27 mpg [us gal] on the trip.the exhaust was quieter going home so still not sure about the sound.droned some under load
I thought the Mark Viii's had 3.23 gears, but I've got an old man's memory. the 27 mpg is great. Funny you mentioned it was quieter on the way home...mine seems to change noise level alot. Some days I wonder what I've been complaining about, other days it seems really really loud.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-09-18 23:32
I thought the Mark Viii's had 3.23 gears, but I've got an old man's memory. the 27 mpg is great. Funny you mentioned it was quieter on the way home...mine seems to change noise level alot. Some days I wonder what I've been complaining about, other days it seems really really loud.
the early ones with dual exhaust had 3.23 gears.the one i took apart had 3.07
not happy with my rad over flow.going to put a tank off a 2000 crown vic and try that
Quote from: canadian_ranchero on 2016-09-18 21:36
i think the problem is in the computer programming.the computer thinks it still has the 3.07 gears and 16 inch tires.mine still seems to pull the hills fine in o/d.i find if i push on the gas a little more it shifts to 3rd or in my case going through the mountains [national park]at 90km [55mph]speed limit i just turned the o/d off.i got about 27 mpg [us gal] on the trip.the exhaust was quieter going home so still not sure about the sound.droned some under load
Been following your thread, is reprogramming these computers something practical? Really just curious....
Gary's background is solid in Ford electronics, but....my thoughts on reprogramming a computer.....
First, the reason I was asking Gary about the year of his engine is the Mark viii's (FORD) used the original(?) OBD I programming thru 1995, then it was OBD II after that. Trying to find anyone who CAN reprogram an OBD I system is very difficult. OBD II reflashing is pretty common. Many performance shops can do it. We have at least one here in town.
When I planned my build, I wanted it a long-time reliable as posible, which to me meant keeping the system as stock as possible. I'm just thinking out loud here, but what happens 5 or 10 years down the road and you are 500 miles from home and you blow out your computer? Are you gonna be stuck finding not only a stock matching computer, but trying to find the guy who originally reflashed the one that burnt out, hoping he kept records? I don't know, but in my case I wouldn't modify an engine enough that it required reprogramming the computer unless it was minimal enough programming changes so that the engine still ran on a stock one....even if it's in "limp-home" mode.
I'll let the expert give his reply now, lol....
Rich, you expressed a lot of the concerns I am feeling these days. In my mind modern electronics seem to condemn mechanical things to a state of malfunction or disrepair. New things seem to be to be designed to be thrown away when they don't work properly. I find that very disturbing especially in light of supposedly "green" concerns. I have a refrigerator that has been repaired, sorta.... the light won't come on. It is probably a single poor pin contact amongst a lot of electronic connectors. I don't think I could handle that in my Ford, hence my "old school" direction. I still think about the benefits of modernization but wonder at what cost? I can fix a carburetor down the road but an aftermarket EFI? Necessary electronic parts are becoming obsolete at an ever increasing rate...much less operating systems. The computer I am using now works as designed but it is obsolete.
Here's something I recently heard that's of concern to me.....automotive computers obviously have programs stored in them, but what I never thought about was how long that computer could hold the program sitting on a shelf or in a car at the wrecking yard. I recently learned/heard that time frame is about 10 years, and then if the internal storage battery is not recharged, the program will be lost.
Any comments on that, Gary?
Yup, your home computer has the same setup. The boot program is kept alive with a battery. Most home computers are replaced before the battery goes bad so there is never a problem. Not sure if the ECMs use a "hard wired" boot or a ram style memory.
The computer that went into the 66 Ranchero was really old. It came out of a late 80s very early 90s Ford and was of the speed density style. Not sure how long it was on the shelf but it was over ten years and worked just fine.
So...to answer the question.....I don't know....just what I did as evidence.
OBD I computers are not that easy to reprogram.i am looking into other options on the early shifting issue.when i first took my ford computer training [OBD I]ford implied[if i remember correctly] the computer main memory would never be lost[will need to reread some of my books]i have used computers almost 15 years old with no problems.some of the ford sensors were used on all engines[EEC IV]and should be available for a few more years. have almost a complete set of extra sensors/computer for my wagon.do not be afraid of fuel injection.you will need some different test equipment and will need to do some reading,but once you use/understand it it is just as easy[if not easyer] as the old carb
I agree! Ford ECMs have an excellent reliability, much better then GM (IMHO) and the feds mandate a long life expectancy for all makes. Trouble shooting is just as simple with the code readers and almost every repair shop has the good readers that will take the problem nearly down to time and date of failure.
A die hard carb guy (street rodder) often stated he would never go with fuel injection because if he broke down there would be no way to "fix" the thing. Well after several conversations and stories of his break downs (engine related, HEI specifically) he decided to try a stock GM tuned port on his last build. Happy as a lark and not a single hiccup for the last ten years.
I would be putting fuel injection on the Ranchero except no one makes a lower intake to fit up a 302 upper and the trimmings. I just don't trust the after market at this point.
Gary...what pressure cap are you running on your radiator? I've got coolant loss somewhere I can't locate except for noticeable spray around the cap. I keep an eye on the other coolants to make sure I don't have an internal leak somewhere, and those are normal. I'm running a 7# cap, which I went with because of the '57 style radiator (though mine is welded aluminum). I'm wondering if the 4.6's generate more coolant pressure.
what temp is your thermostat?is it possible you are on the edge of boiling and sending coolant past your rad cap?the waterless coolant i am running only runs at about 1 to 2 lbs presser.i am running a 16 lbs cap i do not need this high but that is what i have.the lincoln uses a 16 lbs cap
It is doubtful that the t-stat is causing a coolant leak around the rad cap unless the t-stat is stuck closed. The t-stat is designed to prevent coolant flow through the cooling system until a pre-determined temperature thereby allowing the engine to warm up properly. Modern engines also utilize the t-stat to control emissions, provide better cold start driving, improve gas mileage, etc.
Rad caps can be checked to determine if they in fact hold the pressure they are rated for. The rad cap also has a rubber seal which does fail causing leaks around the rad cap. The manufactuer of the radiator should be able to recommend the proper pressure rating for the cap.
I don't think I have an overheating/close to boiling issue. My heat sensor is in the same location that Lincoln used, and my gauge has never reached 200. It runs at 185-195ish....the 195ish when the coolant gets low. The cap doesn't seem to fit as tightly as it should anyway, so I think I'll step up to a 14 lb cap. Lincoln must have used that range for a reason.
was out for a drive yesterday and the early shifting seems to be better/shifting later.it still idles a little fast,but that also seems to be getting better
funny you brought up the idling, I was just going to ask how yours was idling. After a minute or two, like at a long traffic light, mine drops the rpm from about 1k to 600ish and starts idling/loping like it's got a racing cam in it. Several times after a very long drive (2-300 miles), it idles really crappy. It did that inside the goodguys show, and Saturday when all 2500 cars were trying too leave, I wasn't sure it would make it. I almost pulled over to let all the cars go by. lol...sure didn't want to be embarassed by the car dying going thru the narrow tunnel that is used to enter/exit the racetrack. It made it, ran normal at highway speeds, and after a day or two of local driving the idle got back to normal.
I'm also wondering about how you like your steering? If I remember correctly, you went with Borgenson?.
yes i went borgenson,seems to work well,about 3 turns stop to stop
Without going back thru your thread to see, were there any clearance problems with the exhaust? It sure would be awesome to have our cars together so we could test drive each others to actually see/feel the difference in Borgenson vs rack. lol...You ready for a long road trip....how 'bout we meet in Colorado next year? The rack sure is a vast improvement over the oem, but honestly at this point I'm thinking Borgenson might have been a better way to go. Of course it wasn't available back when I did mine, but I'm seriously wondering if there's enough difference to change over some time down the road.
I'm assuming you have no loss of turning radius, but I'm also wondering how your car is returning to center. I will say taking a good look at my installation...ujoints, etc..is something that was on my list of things to do when I got sidetracked on the accident. Mine also seems to have some lumps in the turning that maybe could be eliminated with ujoint adjustment.? U joints if there is a sticking point could be affecting the return to center as well.I just don't know at this point. I also need to check the adjustment of the turning stop bolts which I had in place to see what it is that is actually stopping the turning.
Just finished a Borgeson conversion on a fellow Ford fanatic's 67 Fairlane. He loves it. No lose of turning radius, returns as it should, has good road feel and is as tight as a new car. Good days worth of work. This one was a little more complicated as we had to fit a GM pump to the 86 302 serpentine system. Other then that and shortening the column for the rag joint it was a complete bolt in. Very happy with the ease of installation. Would recommend purchasing the entire kit for good component match up.
if you look back at my posts you will see how tight the exhaust was to the box,needed to put/make a custom exhaust elbow and put in a heat shield.put in a coupler and modifyed the steering coluum as needed.the new set up borgeson has now may not have this problem. i put in some more positive caster[would like some more]seems to return to center o/k.one reason i went this way is one of the last owners had redone the steering linkage,so it was almost new.with the granada spindles i think i have more turning radius than stock.i used the 4.6 power steering pump[it came off the mustang i got the hydro boost from]has power assist at idle[some early ford pumps have a problem with this]hope i have answered your questions.when is the colorado show?you never know,a long road trip would be fun
You answered my questions...thanks.
There's only 2 big shows in Colorado that I know of...the nsra in Pueblo in the spring, and the Goodguys up north of Denver in September. There's some smaller shows that are really neat throughout the summer. I forget what town you live in...seem like it was due north of Wyoming someplace? Keep it in mind...too early probably for both of us to be planning for next year. I lived in Colorado for 23 years...I'd be a good tour guide. Maybe we could start a '57 get-together/cruise. There's 3 or 4 members on this forum I get to visit with occationally.
still working on my idle issue.found a ford service bulletin talking about a kit to help repair idle issues ford part f2pz-9f939-a.have one on the way.will post the result when i get it in the car
Please do. I didn't drive the donor MarkViii long enough to have any idling issues, but I'm pretty sure it didn't, and the previous owner had stated he never had any issues with the car whatsoever since he bought it new. So, makes me wonder which of the changes I made when I swapped it into the '57 are causing the issue...exhaust deleting the cat. converters and (2) O2 sensors, wiring in general,mods to the intake plenum, etc, etc
I gotta get one more long cruise done on mine before potential of getting caught in a winter storm sets in....may head up to Colorado for the weekend....60* and zero chance of percipitation for the next 5 days...sounds good to me!
Several things to add to the idle issue. I have a friend who installed a 96 4.6dohc into a '36 Chevy for a local guy. His also came out of a Mark VIII with no idle issues. This install was done with a specially modified harness and a reprogramed computer. Alot of sensors, egr stuff,etc were eliminated. He is running only 2 O2 sensors as we are. His idle is exactly like mine. Idles fine for about 2 minutes, then idle speed drops and it starts loping like it's got a hot cam in it. So, three different approaches to computer/wiring installation with similar results.
I went up into the mountains again this week, and the same thing happened as it did the first time I got up there....my check engine light never came on all the time I was at the higher altitude. I'll have to check what the altitude actually was, but guessing it was 2-3k feet higher than Colorado Springs, so I'm thinking 8-10K. This time I paid attention to the idleing and if anything it was worse in that it got to the loping point quicker.
So considering the repeat of the no-check-engine light at higher altitude, I'm not sure what that's indicating, but there's got to be something!!, and I'm thinking the thrown codes also have nothing to do with the idling, as one appears to have got better, and one worse.
What kind of a kit is it that you have ordered? A Ford part that is still available? Is this wiring, or hardware? Both me and my friend are anxious to hear about your results.
Rich, I can say I really do not know much about this but I have a guess...Sounds like the engine runs fine when it is just started almost like it is in a "start" mode. Once the engine has started and run for a bit the issue starts as "temperature" is reached and the computer starts to actuate the non existant EGR system the issue begins. Perhaps the computer is injecting a bit more or a bit less fuel to compensate and the programming allows the O2 sensor outputs to vary a bit as part of the EGR operation. Altitude seems like it could impact the situation if this were the case. NOx is the pollutant controlled by the EGR but I don't think the computer measures it directly??? Maybe it is factoring the O2 sensor outputs??? WAG
I have all my egr stuff, in fact, I replaced the valve and sensor with new before installing the engine. My friend's 36 Chevy had the egrs removed, but the computer was reprogramed. and Gary/Canadian Ranchero I believe deleted the EGR's, not sure what he did about the programing.
Gotcha! Just following the problem, interested in the solution.
The input is appreciated. :001:
Very frustrating chasing gremlins in an EFI system without diagnostic tools...much like tweaking a carburetor. Experience or guessing. Since at cold startup, the idle is correct and issues arise at operating temperature, the Coolant Temperature Sensor (CTS) could be responsible. The OEM geniuses us two sensors for coolant temperature. One sensor, the CTS for the ECM and the other for the gauge. So, just because your gauge says the engine is at operating temperature doesn't mean the ECM sees the same data. If I had to GUESS, I'd change the CTS. It's readily available, fairly cheap, and easy to change.
DISCLAIMER: I hate guessing and strongly recommend using a diagnostic tool. Using and becoming familiar with a tool is critical to affordable repairs.
Another guess would be to look into the altitude sensor.
this kit is used when the idle is slow/loping.it fits between the intake and the idle air motor.it lets you set the idle speed manually with out moving the idle setting on the throttle body.ford had a problem in the early 90's as the idle passages filled with deposits it would slow the idle down to the point of stalling/hunting/loping and this kit would fix this most of the time.if you want rich,you could try clean your throttle body and idle air motor.then reset/check your idle speed,let the computer relearn the new speed.that may help your problem
wow, all kinds of new stuff here. Firstly, I thought the idle was a computer function, I had no idea there was an idle adjustment on the throttle body. second...idle air motor??? what is that all about and where is it?
I may have misspoke or wasn't clear about my idle issue....it doesn't make any difference what the engine temp is...hot or cold, it'll idle fine for about a minute at about 1k rpm then drop the rpm down to about 600. that's when the loping starts. So, with that said, and keeping in mind I can drive down the street at 30mph in second gear without my foot on the gas at the 1k idle speed, I'm not sure adjusting the idle is going to help or be something I want to do. I need to find out why it is dropping to the 600 after that minute or so. Just sounds to me like something beyond or other than an idle speed adjustment.
One of my throttle body vehicles requires a through cleaning from time to time. There's are throttle body cleaner spray much like carb cleaner.
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-11-13 17:48
wow, all kinds of new stuff here. Firstly, I thought the idle was a computer function, I had no idea there was an idle adjustment on the throttle body. second...idle air motor??? what is that all about and where is it?
I may have misspoke or wasn't clear about my idle issue....it doesn't make any difference what the engine temp is...hot or cold, it'll idle fine for about a minute at about 1k rpm then drop the rpm down to about 600. that's when the loping starts. So, with that said, and keeping in mind I can drive down the street at 30mph in second gear without my foot on the gas at the 1k idle speed, I'm not sure adjusting the idle is going to help or be something I want to do. I need to find out why it is dropping to the 600 after that minute or so. Just sounds to me like something beyond or other than an idle speed adjustment.
you have a base idle setting on the throttle body and the idle air motor[computer controled]controls the idle speed[and fast idle] from there.when you first start the engine it goes to fast idle[about 1k]then as the engine warms up it goes to a slower warm idle speed.if that is too slow the computer will try adjusting the speed. it may lop/hunt/stall when doing this.that is why i think you should try clean the idle system/throttle body.the idle air motor is bolted to the intake beside the throttle body[pass side at the back]hope this helps
I've been wondering if you received the idle kit?
I've been trying to get a bathroom remodel done before our guests arrive for Christmas week, so I haven't had a chance to fiddle with mine yet. I did order a new idle air valve/motor and gasket which I got today, and a new throttle position sensor being sent from a different warehouse, so I won't get that until maybe next week, and I picked up a can of throttle body cleaner.
After I clean the throttle body and install the new parts, I'll clean the engine codes off, and disconnect the power to the computer and then put it thru a run at idle for two minutes in Park, run at two minutes in gear, and run for two minutes in gear with the A/C on. That's suppose to force the computer to relearn the engine idle info.
the car is in the garage for the winter.i have about 4-5 inches of snow and the temp tonight -25c[-10f].so not sure when i mite get the idle kit in [maybe at xmas time]
Ouch. I won't bitch about it getting down to the 20's the past few nights. I hate that winter is on us. It is suppose to be in the high 60's for the weekend though...maybe i need to sneak in a road trip.
I got my throttle position sensor in today. After looking at pics of 4.6's to figure out exactly where it was, I'm not sure I can get to it in the car.....may need or be easier to to remove the throttle body with it attached....foresee any problems or stuff to watch for doing that.? One You Tube video I watched the mechanic preferred to clean the throttle bodies out of the car anyways.
I think the circled part is the throttle position sensor?
Quote from: RICH MUISE on 2016-12-08 00:30
Ouch. I won't bitch about it getting down to the 20's the past few nights. I hate that winter is on us. It is suppose to be in the high 60's for the weekend though...maybe i need to sneak in a road trip.
I got my throttle position sensor in today. After looking at pics of 4.6's to figure out exactly where it was, I'm not sure I can get to it in the car.....may need or be easier to to remove the throttle body with it attached....foresee any problems or stuff to watch for doing that.? One You Tube video I watched the mechanic preferred to clean the throttle bodies out of the car anyways.
I think the circled part is the throttle position sensor?you are correct that is the throttle position sensor.if you pull off the throttle body make sure you put on a new gasket.also clean the air bypass hole in the throttle body[small hole between the 2 butterflies]hope this helps
Yeah, thanks. I'm sure you probably said, but when you wired your car up, did you modify/reflash the computer?
Between you, me and my local friend with a 4.6 dohc in a '36 Chevy coupe, I think we approached the wiring 3 different ways, yet we all have basically the same idling issue. So far the only common ground I see is that all three of us eliminated the back two O2 sensors, only utilizing the front two. My friend really likes the fact that it rock and rolls in idle sounding like a racing cam. I don't really mind it, but I'm concerned it may get worse, so that's why I'm trying to chase down the cause, or at least eliminate some potential causes.
pre 1996[OBD1] only used the front 02 sensers,did not use back sensers[OBD2 did].i did not touch the computer,it is from a 93 mark.i am sure you have checked for vacuum leaks and air leaks between the mass air and the throttle body.mine does not stall or idle poorly.it is idling a little faster than i would like and seems slow to come off fast idle
I guess I misunderstood what your idle issue was, and now I understand why you picked up that kit. A fast idle in these cars is not real good...mine isn't especially fast at about 1k, but I can drive down a street with a 30mph speed limit without having my foot on the gas pedal.
Hi guys. I have been enjoying following the posts on the 4.6 swaps. If you don't mind I would like to ask a question. I installed 4.6 in a 61 Galaxie and have been driving the car this summer. I used a Ron Francis harness. Tranny shifts great but I keep getting a PO 500 code...VSS sensor. As per Ron Francis suggestions I replaced the VSS sensor and ran new wires to panel to eliminate interference. Still get code. Any of you guys have a similar issue? Francis seems to be out of ideas. I wonder about a programming issue?
Thanks!
if it was mine i would get a break out box[ford service tool]and test the sensor and wiring
Ok. I think you are suggesting to check voltage from sensor when it is rotating and at panel?
you say wires hooked to panel?the vss sensor wires are hooked to the computer.and yes check vss output when output shaft is moving
OK will check voltage. With Ron Francis kit, the VSS sensor wires run to a panel where they connect to the computer wires. The panel is more of a "terminal end" board. Wires from the sensors connect to one side of the panel and the wires from the computer connect to the opposite side of the panel. Its just a way for the new wires from the kit to connect to the factory style plug that goes into the computer.
make sure the vss wires are hooked to the correct terminals on the computer
Gary........lower radiator hose. What are you using, and of course to go along with that, what radiator thermostat housing are you using? Does your housing face forward?
I've got a loopdy-loop type of rubber hose that was actually the mid section of a longer hose. No problem with cooling issues, ,but the only hose I could find that was the right shape was the correct size on the engine side, but smaller on the radiator side, so I've got a Mickey Mouse setup with rubber bushings to step it down to the hose diameter. I've got a leak there that keeps coming back, so time to address the problem. I lose about 2 quarts a month,btw.
look at reply 243 you can see the thermostat housing i am using.it is off a late 90's taurus 4 valve 3 liter.it is the same as the mark but has no fitting for the expansion tank.you can also see i used the stainless steel flexible rad hose[i do not have a picture of the lower hose but did use the same ss rad hose]i also changed the hose from the oil filter adapter[from a 2000 crown vic. the hose outlet is higher] to a 45 from the straight hose.if you look at reply 178 you can see where my rad hoses go on the radiator.hope this helps
Thanks for looking up your old posts.....appreciated.
Now I know what you did won't help. Radiator outlets are totally different, so which engine components you used won't help me. I bought some ss hose kits like you used, but couldn't use them........the bends were too radical.