What is the best way to my dead FOM out of the car? The cross member frozen in the frame at this point. So any ideas? I have one brewing that uses my hoist but wanted to hear the experts first?
Mike
When you say the transmission crossmember, is "frozen" in place, do you mean that somebody welded it to the frame? I have seen that a few times, as it is not uncommon for the bolts to either snap off when trying to remove them, or the threaded bolt holes in the frame rails strip out. If you want to leave the crossmember alone, I would recommend removing the engine and transmission as a single unit, and then unbolt the transmission once the engine is out. You may be able to slide the trans far enough back to remove the torque convertor and bellhousing, and then "nose drive" the transmission between the back of the engine and the crossmember, but I have never tried that, plus the trans is a pretty awkward, heavy, and most likely, slippery, item, so kinda dangerous in my opinion.
Thanks Meteor,
Crap, there is no engine in the car now and the granny has been sitting on the exh pipe so long that it compressed the part that goes right over the crossmember. I can soak the two bolts that hold the cross member on either side for about a month or so. Does the cross member then just drop out?
The way I was contemplating is to use my hoist, bolt it to the bell housing and then see if I can gingerly scootch it over the pipe and cross member out the front.
Mike
Is this a sedan/hardtop/wagon, or a convertible/retractable? Not sure about the later models, but the non open roof cars have 3 bolts on either side , attaching the transmission crossmember to the sides of the frame rails. Since you have no engine, I would try using the engine hoist to pull the transmission, but be aware if you use a chain on the bellhousing, once the tailhousing clears the crossmember, the trans will turn straight up, spewing trans fluid from the end, unless it is fully drained, or you have a slip yoke over the output shaft splines, or some type of plug.
The trans cross member should slide out with a little persuasion from a hammer and block of wood. One thing you could try is place a floor jack under the transmission pan, then remove the cross member. Lower the jack and roll the trans out. Make sure the car is jacked up high enough to clear the bellhousing.
Once the bolts are removed, a little persuation with a BFH should get it out by tapping the crossmember towards the rear of the car because the frame gets wider behind the crossmember.
Even more fun is when it is time to reinstall the crossmember, and trying to get those six bolt holes lined up again! A tapered line up bar and hammer are very handy.
Thanks guys, I am guessing that they only put two bolts in at the factory as that is all I see. I started soaking them with kroil today and will try to unbolt them next month or so. I am in no real hurry as the engine and new tranny won't go in for awhile yet. This is just something that needs to get done eventually.
Mike
Should be three.....
Quote from: 59meteor on 2021-09-26 13:54
Even more fun is when it is time to reinstall the crossmember, and trying to get those six bolt holes lined up again! A tapered line up bar and hammer are very handy.
X2, always a fight for me on every 57 I have owned. I wonder how the factory did it? Maybe they bolted the cross member to the frame rails before welding the other cross members
Jim, considering how "sprung" the transmission crossmember seems to be, I wonder if maybe they welded the end mounts of the crossmember that bolt to the frame rails, onto the center tube section, after the ends are bolted up? Also, the welds on my 59s transmission crossmember are really ugly, like done by a high school shop students first attempt at welding.
I saw an NOS cross member once on eBay, the ends were separate... I bought a '59 to put in my car (it had a fabricated one) and it went in about as well as could be expected. I use a large ratchet type tie down wrapped around the front part of the frame to pull it in place.
Must be a per-car thing. Mine was just perfectly snug. went in from the back to within a 1/2 inch or so, then a few taps with a nylon mallet got it right where it needed to be. Could be all the welding I did on mine shrunk it up a little. I don't remember how tough it was to remove, but you'd expect a rusted-in one to be a little tougher to get out.
Quote from: 59meteor on 2021-09-27 11:41
Jim, considering how "sprung" the transmission crossmember seems to be, I wonder if maybe they welded the end mounts of the crossmember that bolt to the frame rails, onto the center tube section, after the ends are bolted up? Also, the welds on my 59s transmission crossmember are really ugly, like done by a high school shop students first attempt at welding.
Thats a good possibility. I've heard a lot of people complain about the welding on the frames and I have to say mine are pretty good in all the locations. Did Ford make the frames or were they supplied by a vendor? I seem to remember the truck frames were supplied from a vendor..
The welds on mine are embarrassing. Texas car. I was dying to redo all the the welds but that wouldn't be right for a correct restoration. Ugly but correct.
I really have no problems with the welds on my actual car frame, but some of the welding on smaller pieces, most noticeably the transmission crossmember, and to a lesser degree, the upper rear shock crossmember, and a couple of the body mount brackets. But I suppose that we need to keep in mind, back then, much of the welding would have been stick Arc welding, by an actual human, not the sterile computer operated procedure, with everything held in perfect alignment with complicated jigs and fixtures. I like watching some of the auto assembly line films/videos on youtube, quite a contrast between a modern factory, and one 40,50, 60 or more years ago.
Funny, I was just studying the welds on a frame cut that I'm using for a try-out mule.
I was wondering if it wasn't the weldor's first frame, on his first day? :003:
Stick welds. Looks like the current was set to 500 amps and the operator had to drag as fast as possible.
I'll snap a pic at my next work session.
When I had the body off my Courier and was removing 60 years of dirt/surface rust etc I noticed the the welds looked different in quality from side to side and in a couple of cases front to back. Almost like the guy was more awake by the time the tail of the frame got to him that when he started at the front. :icon_scratch:
Of course Hentry liked to keep it all in-house, but are y'all familiar with the Mechanical Marvel?
http://smithpumps.com/news/1012/articles/worlds-first-automated-construction-assembly-line-the-mechanical-marvel-4/
"...By the spring of 1921, the Mechanical Marvel was ready for operation. It was capable of manufacturing 10,000 frames per day. Each frame required 552 separate operations and in an average day the Mechanical Marvel exceeded 4 million operations. Every eight seconds a completed frame went to storage or into a railcar for delivery to the automakers. This historic assemblage of machines and processes required 180 men to operate it. In contrast, before the Mechanical Marvel was put into operation the Company could produce 3,000 frames per day with 2,000 operators.
The Mechanical Marvel manufactured frames for 37 years until further welding advances in frame making mandated retirement on June 24, 1958. By 1978, the A.O. Smith Automotive Division had supplied in excess of 93 million passenger car frames and over 33 million truck frames. The Mechanical Marvel received recognition by the ASME as a National Historic Mechanical Engineering Landmark in 1979."
Great info, thank you for posting. That link kind of confirms my thinking that the frames were made by a vendor..
Interesting. My uncle worked at A O Smith until he retired in the early 70s.
...In addition to Ford frames, and later the 68-70 Shelby Mustangs , AO Smith also manufactured household appliances, like hot water tanks.