57 convertible, in project jail since 1996

[brushwolf]

Switched to the Galaxie mounts. Lower, but worse overall. 400 manifolds now hit engine mounts both sides to the extent where they would both need spacers in them to just barely clear the manifold. And engine moved forward about an inch. Pan is also sitting on crossmember. Those are a lost cause for my install.

Will have to figure out how to modify Butch's mounts to sit lower... 

[Ford Blue blood]

I used the Galaxie mounts with 3/4" spacer between the mount and the block.  Engine sets perfect, pan has a good solid 1/2" clearance and the stock 351C 2bbl manifolds clear the 64 Galaxie box and the stock frame brackets.

[brushwolf]

Well I might try that if I can't figure out a way to make Butch's mounts work. 3/4" spacers at to top of those Galaxie mounts would probably leave just enough clearance for my 400M manifolds. These manifolds are larger dimensionally and internally compared to the 351c manifolds. Less restrictive basically.

I have a 58 steering box and plenty of clearance on driver side no matter engine height in chassis.

How much room do you have between the front crossmember and front pulley on the crank?

[brushwolf]

As you can maybe see in the last 2 pics of previous post, I removed the rubber cushion on the Butch's mounts and now the engine sits pretty darn good heightwise... Still plenty of exhaust manifold clearance to mounts, steering box, oil pan clearance more than enough. Firewall clearance actually increases the lower the engine goes.

I am concerned the repro import Galaxie mounts might turn mushy in short order, so would rather have the sturdier Butch's mounts in there. I would be content with the way the engine sits by just welding the 2 halves of the Butch's mounts together.

However, IDT I want solid mounts either. 

Suggestions on how I can modify the Butch's mounts to allow some sort of cushioning without changing the location of the engine as it sits currently, but with at least some cushioning in place as opposed to it sitting solid like it is now?

I really don't want to cut or modify the car's frame mount itself, just in case I ever decide to put a 312 back in it... (I have 2 rebuilt 312's and a peppy 292 bored .040 sitting here too).

[brushwolf]

I really like the place the engine is sitting right now, but IDT I can make the Butch's mounts work.  Also tried a set of 73 Mustang 351c mounts.  Those sit even higher than the Butch's mounts sit in as-delivered configuration.

Decided I wasted enough time reading engine swap mount threads on multiple forums and ordered a pair of 77-78 LTD mounts that are very similar to the Galaxie mounts, but have the ears for a horizontal thru-bolt instead of the stud on the frame side of mount.

Since they are similar profile, I expect the motor will sit too low again, but I will make up an intermediary plate or rectangular tubing to sit between the motor and frame mounts, perhaps with a round tube inside to put the horizontal bolt through.

Crossing my fingers that there is enough room to do that and still keep the engine where it is, or lower cuz I still have some room to go down and a tad I can go back.  This will mess up my clutch linkage shaft alignment further, but the engine has to be way further forward for those to align anyway, so will change the frame side bracket position to align once the motor and transmission mounts are finished.

[Ford Blue blood]

Best pictures I have of the pulley to cross member fit and engine "fit".  It is an after market pulley.  The carburetor is level with the car at ride height.

That picture of the cross member also shows the 58 Edsel front sway bar.

[Rancher]

Has an Anchor 2726 type mount been considered?

Not saying it's the solution.

[RICH MUISE]

One thing to look at on the idea of using the horizontal bolt and tube is accessibility once the car is assembled. I'm using a totally different family of engine in mine, so can't compare, and I know mine has waaaay less space width-wise to work, but I know at least with my engine that horizontal bolt just wouldn't be able to access.

One other train of thought to consider.........I know the early 00s Mustang has the same angle engine mount as our '57s. Bear with me for a minute, but I used an Anchor motor mount for '01(?) Mustang GT/Cobra 4.6 for my '95 Lincoln 4.6 that had the same angle mounting plate and stud, so I'm thinking maybe there might be an engine family that is in the same family as what you're using that is made for the Mustangs. All I had to do was add a slot in the '57 mounting plate to accommodate Mustang's stud location.
Some of our members are into Mustangs, so they may be able to answer that.

[Rancher]

I wondered about folding the horizontal mount's "ears" over  a flat plate, with stud. The bit of welding heat needed at the folded ears would be quite removed from rubber.

Edit - Or "clip" the ears, leaving just enough ear to "catch" a flat plate?

But now it's an oddball custom mount, rather than shelf stock.

[brushwolf]

It looks like we have roughly the same fan and firewall clearance, which is to be expected with the same 351c motor.  Wasn't sure I remembered where exactly the radiator sat over the front crossmember in stock position. But, looks like plenty of room even if I used a fan clutch.

And same as me you have more than enough clearance from the steering gear, though our manifolds are slightly different. I can't really set engine angle yet cuz so much has changed on suspension and the car is still a foot off the floor on blocks. Probably do a temporary transmission mount til it is back one the ground so I can fiddle with driveline angle after more parts are on.

Still have all door glasses, frames and mechanisms, entire front clip, battery, radiator, dash, heater, seats, trunklid, bumpers, exhaust and many other parts to reinstall. So guessing it is probably 800- 1000 lbs of additional stuff that is on different parts of the car and will change ride height somewhat on both ends.  So, neither front or rear suspension is torqued down yet.

Wondering if I made a mistake cutting too much off coils in front too, as it appears it may sit too low in front and not even the clip is on it yet. May have to put a different set of coils in once the car is back on the ground. I have a quite a few uncut 57-58 front spring pairs still around here somewhere.

Don't really want to use lowering blocks to get the rear further down and hoping the as-yet-uninstalled parts will drop it a couple inches in the rear from where it looks like it wants to be now. I don't even have new springs in the rear, just reconditioned originals.  So, I thought if anything it might sit lower in the rear than stock. But it looks higher than stock. Maybe the big tires? Happen to know how tall the original tires were?

I do have a rear sway bar and traction bars on it, but those are not securely fastened yet (cuz of the uncertainty of eventual ride height), so they should not be holding the rear up at all. I have blocks between the axle and garage floor so the rear weight is sitting on the axle and I even have a bunch of junk in the trunk that should substitute the weight of some of the missing parts.
Too much of a guessing game though, so will just carry on trying to get parts back on.

My heater stuff was all reconditioned 10+ years ago, but I still have not decided what dash to use. I think the dash frames are the same from 57-58 and I have a couple bare dashes and a couple dashes that still have everything in them including wiring. Will stick with the black faced 57 instruments and knobs. Still have the original radio from my 57 convertible I had in the early 70's and that is in nice shape, a nice clock and a bunch of reconditioned speedometer parts I have yet to reassemble.

And I still need to install some inside insulation. I suppose I could do the firewall insulation first since dash would get in the way of doing that. Think I have a repro piece for that.  So much stuff yet to do... 90 degrees out and it is deer fly month here in Central MN, so mostly staying in the garage with the AC.

[brushwolf]

Has an Anchor 2726 type mount been considered?

Not saying it's the solution.

Yes, I have saved pics of the Anchor 2725 and 2726.  I know they have been used with some pre-57 swaps and some prefer them cuz they don't require spacers the way the Galaxie mount does.  Not sure about them for the "lower and wider" 57 chassis, but may pick up a set of those to try if I don't like the LTD mounts..

Potential downsides might be too much height again (though they look pretty close to what I need), and I am not crazy about the stud type mount unless a crossbolt will not fit.

[brushwolf]

One thing to look at on the idea of using the horizontal bolt and tube is accessibility once the car is assembled. I'm using a totally different family of engine in mine, so can't compare, and I know mine has waaaay less space width-wise to work, but I know at least with my engine that horizontal bolt just wouldn't be able to access.

One other train of thought to consider.........I know the early 00s Mustang has the same angle engine mount as our '57s. Bear with me for a minute, but I used an Anchor motor mount for '01(?) Mustang GT/Cobra 4.6 for my '95 Lincoln 4.6 that had the same angle mounting plate and stud, so I'm thinking maybe there might be an engine family that is in the same family as what you're using that is made for the Mustangs. All I had to do was add a slot in the '57 mounting plate to accommodate Mustang's stud location.
Some of our members are into Mustangs, so they may be able to answer that.

Yes, I have a 4.6 in my Sport Trac.  Looking under the hood makes me yearn for simpler times. They are very wide, but I think I have plenty of room for install and removal of a cross-bolt. The only question is whether there is enough space between the LTD mount and the frame mount for an adapter piece to fit between them without getting the engine too high again.

The 5.0 Mustang mounts looked interesting to me since they bolt to the engine the same as a Cleveland, but some people say they are too high also (in what year chassis, I forget, I read too many swap threads..). My 351c 73 Mustang mounts are really high, but the later 5.0 Mustang mounts do appear shorter.  Unlike metal fabrication though, it seems easier to add material than to subtract material with this engine mount business.

So still keeping an open mind, just hoping I don't accumulate a dozen sets of different motor mounts before I find one that makes me happy.  I have a couple other back-burner 5.0 projects though and my son has a 3rd one also, so maybe I can use the extras on those (5.0 & T5 into Datsun 280ZX, 5.0 & T5 into MGB, etc..)

[brushwolf]

I wondered about folding the horizontal mount's "ears" over  a flat plate, with stud. The bit of welding heat needed at the folded ears would be quite removed from rubber.

Edit - Or "clip" the ears, leaving just enough ear to "catch" a flat plate?

But now it's an oddball custom mount, rather than shelf stock.

Well, it would be nice to have a shelf stock mount, but would rather cut and weld some bolt on parts than the car frame. Clipping the ears and welding to a plate (tapered plate if the angles do not match) with studs that match the existing frame holes would be an idea if there is not sufficient space to put an adapter for a cross-bolt in between the frame and engine mount.

I think I could weld that plate on the mount a 1/4" at a time and then immediately dunking it in a bucket of water to keep from burning up the rubber.  Pair of the mounts is less than $30, so it wouldn't be the end of the world if I screwed them up trying it.

[brushwolf]

Or, an even simpler way to correct any angle differences would be to install the mounts, see if we have some angle difference,  mark the ears, remove mounts and cut the ears off at a very slight angle to match the frame mount angle, reinstall on motor and tack weld the plate with the 2 studs in it with optimized engine location. Remove again to finish weld and reinforce if necessary...

The plate with 2 studs I could just cut off some old 54-58 mounts with studs already in them to get those started.. I used some of those same pieces before making mounts for a SBC into a Toyota Mark IV...   Or those same old engine mount pieces could be the basis for a cross-bolt adapter too... I like that idea...

Think that will be my option 2 on the 3rd set of mounts once they arrive, with option 1 still being a cross-bolted adapter if space allows for it...

[brushwolf]

Has an Anchor 2726 type mount been considered?

Not saying it's the solution.

Given the failures of repro imported mounts, I think if I tried those Anchor 2725 and 2726 it would just be to see if they fit and if they did then order these prothane mounts.  The bottom plate appears to unbolt which means you could relocate the stud and even install 2 studs that matched the frame mount holes (still may have an angle differential to address though).  You could take the plate off a stock repro mount too by removing the rivets, but if the rubber is failing then that is a pretty big downside..

In fact even if the LTD mounts work, I may see if Prothane has one like that to use instead. Just use the cheapie mounts to make sure it fits like you want and then get a Prothane or similar aftermarket mount to put in its place.

I also wonder about whether using these mounts in non-stock applications whether the rubber is being twisted a bit to get the motor where it is desired and these things were never meant to take torsional stresses like that.  When I tried the Galaxie mounts it appeared to me that I had to twist just a bit or the engine was not straight in the chassis.  Maybe not all the fault is in the rubber quality and some of it is in forcing them where we need them.

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1957-ford-fairlane-engine-swap.964715/