Pinion seal

[RICH MUISE]

I picked up a pinion seal kit. It's got the seal, an o-ring,a new crush nut,and a large gasket. I found out today the knowledgeable mechanic I used to replace the axle seals last fall is no longer doing repair work for the public. So, I'm looking for a new mechanic, and have concerns because I know/have read about the pinion gear being a critical area for torquing. My question is, does the whole pumpkin/axels have to come out in order to replace the large (10"ish)fiber gasket?
Any advise on what to look for when talking to a new shop, other than experienced on Ford 9"ers?

[thomasso]

There is no need to remove the pumpkin to replace the pinion seal  Replace large gasket only if leaking. Just remove pinion assembly.  Follow shop manual procedure. Pinion bearing preload is critical, don't overtighten.  Good time to inspect pinion bearings. Gear pattern or side bearing preload will not be effected. Do not alter pinion depth shims.  Tom.

[RICH MUISE]

Thanks for the info, Tom. I'm not sure if the large gasket is leaking, I don't think so. I'll crawl under there when the temps get a bit warmer, and get a look. I won't be the one doing it, getting too old.

[hiball3985]

Rich, do you have an original large pinion seal rear end or a later model small seal?. Setting up the rear end isn't something most mechanics can do. I'm lucky and have a company that only does rear ends close by, been doing it for 50+ years. I won't do it my self. Good luck finding someone.

[RICH MUISE]

Hey Jim. To be honest, I'm not 100% sure what got changed out when I had the rear end modified 6 years ago. It still has the what-ever-it-came-with housing, but not sure what you meant by "later model"...... Later in the '57 year production, or a later year? As far as I know the pinion seal should be "normal".......never saw any options for seal size when I was searching for the kit.......assumed all '57s were the same.
I'm very uncomfortable with who I've found so far, may cancel the appointment I have for the 6th, and just keep adding fluid once in a while.....at least til I find someone I'm comfortable with. Can't risk getting the car "hung up" on someone's lift because I got the wrong seal.
Please elaborate on the "later model small pinion seal".

[gasman826]

An OEM, '57 pinion seal was a one-year only.  It is larger than all the other years of OEM and aftermarket.

[RICH MUISE]

Well, then I may not have the correct one. Anybody have a measurement for the '57 seal so I can check what I got.
I'm not wanting to open the sealed package in case I can return if needed. As near as I can measure the new Seal's OD (not flange) is 3.005", and the ID is 1.390".

[59meteor]

Actually, the pinion seal on my original 3rd member in my 59 also had the oddball, much larger OD pinion seal. Since I was having a buddy, who does differentials for a living, and also does about 1/2 the race cars at the Mission Raceway dragstrip, I had him build 3 complete 3rd members for me, with gear ratios for "normal" driving (3.50), dragstrip (4.33), and freeway (the original 2.91s that were in my 59). Since I was also going to stronger 31 spline axles, I also had him use the larger bearing "Daytona" pinion support, and larger billet 1350 sized pinion flanges. The early pinion seals are hard to find, if you can find a 9" specialist, maybe he can supply a later pinion support that the seals are easier to obtain. AND, properly set the pinion bearing preload. It takes a lot of torque to get the new "crush sleeve" to start collapsing.

[hiball3985]

Like what was mentioned the 57 was a one year only design. Here is the 57 (red one) and the dirty one is the later design with the small seal. I used the later one, had it rebuilt.

[RICH MUISE]

I may have the right one then, not 100%. On the red on, it appears I can see the lip of the seal under the yoke (something missing there?) On the dirty one, it's covered, so I have no way to tell if the smaller one is visibly smaller, or if it's a measurement thing. As mentioned, the new one I have is about 3.00 on outer diameter where it presses into the bore. Any idea what the smaller one would measure, or is 3" the smaller one?
Thanks for posting the pics, Jim.

[hiball3985]

Nothing missing, just the way it is    The large seal measured 4" on the OD, small seal 3".

[RICH MUISE]

That's what I needed.Thanks Jim!! I do have the wrong one. That info was just verified by Yukon Gear and axle. I need a 4.125 seal. He said it was used on 57-60(?) and the smaller seal started in '61. Now another search. he gave me a number to orede at Autozone, and another number if Ebay.
Autozone: 30135
Ebay YMS 6930

[hiball3985]

It maybe 4.125, it's under a bench now and I didn't want to drag it out to get an exact measure. As far as I know it was 57 only and the other change and I don't remember what year, they eliminated the fill plug. I made that mistake one time many years ago 

[59meteor]

Jim, 57 thru 60 makes sense, as my 59s original rearend also had the larger seal OD, with a leather seal ring. As for the lack of a filler plug, ran into that many years ago, when I swapped in a center section for a 63 or 64 Merc. Ended up having to pour the gear oil in thru the end of the housing before installing the axles, and hoping the amount listed in the shop manual was accurate! I guess Ford was putting the filler plugs back in the case, in the later 60s, as all my 69-70 Mustangs and Failanes had them.

[RICH MUISE]

I ordered the larger seal from Autozone. Will be here in a week. Monday I need to call the guys I bought the kit from and find out if all the other stuff like the o-ring and crush thingie is usable. If not, I'll order a larger seal KIT and cancel AutoZone. I'll let you guys know what I find out.