Power steering box to fit my '57 Ranchero

[dmkberger]

I had one in the car when I got it... I traded it and now regret it.
I am going to measure that same box in the '57 Fairlane it went into and will determine whether or not it will work.
I just want the damn thing to steer so I can move on and get it running and driving...

[Ford Blue blood]

It is by about 3/8".  There are great dimensions out there, remember seeing them somewhere, not sure if it was on their web site.  Basically any box/rack from 62 and newer will require steering column modifications.  The 62 Bird column I used is stock length, just did a little trim on the end to fit the rag joint on to it.

[RICH MUISE]

quote Bill:"It is by about 3/8".............was that in reply to Tom's statement that it is larger, or mine saying I thought it was smaller?

[Tom S]

I thought I've read many times the Borg. box was smaller than the oem?

You may be right, Rich. Not sure thouugh. It wouldn't be the first time I'd got one of these steering box measurements confused/wrong.  Might depend on how or where someone measured.
I got to wondering if it was how high the different boxes sat up from the frame caused the clearance problem with my 390 exhaust manifold.
So just before it got dark this afternoon I trudged out in the cold & snow* to again take some measurements on the ratty '58 Ranchero's steering box.
*(Ha! there must only be 1 or 2" of snow left out there right now after all the freeze & thaw stuff that's been going on here.)
Sort of surprised to find that the '58 box must be 1.5" to 2" shorter from the frame top than the Borg.  Can't measure from the same exact point on the frame because of the '58's different shape from the Borg box.
Couple pix with the best measurements I could do. I think the ones of the Borg box are pretty accurate.

[Tom S]

I just want the damn thing to steer so I can move on and get it running and driving...

I hear that!  From what you're saying it sounds like you do not have a steering box or column at all.  Bad news!
Don't know how I lost this but I finally found the article where they put a Borgeson box into a '57. My Borg box does not have that mounting plate that they show welded to the box.
They go into the modifications needed to the steering column. Just keep scrolling down.  Some of the pix may be a little slow to load but they seem to do a good job of describing things.
https://www.hotrod.com/articles/borgeson-universal-power-steering-50s-60s-cars/ 

[59meteor]

The photo of the Borgenson box with the FE shows very little clearance between the iron exhaust manifold and the steering box. One would have to wonder if the heat from the exhaust manifold would not be detrimental concerning the lube inside the box. Even the Hot Rod article, showing a 57 with a 302 and stock exhaust manifolds looks fairly close. I think any headers for a FE engine with the Borgenson box would be problematic. I will try to put up a couple of photos of my 59s stock steering box, with a 428FE, and the FPA headers made specifically for the 57-59 Ford cars.

[Tom S]

The photo of the Borgenson box with the FE shows very little clearance between the iron exhaust manifold and the steering box.

Actually there is zero clearance. It is touching the exhaust manifold midway between the #7 & #8 exhaust ports.
It was worse with even more area in contact but by doing some grinding on the box & manifold I had gained a very minimal amount of clearance between them. Haven't quite figured out how that clearance went away after a while but do have my theories.  I did run across an old post where someone had the same problem with the stock 390 manifold & an aftermarket steering box.

I think any headers for a FE engine with the Borgenson box would be problematic.

Some, maybe most, headers would be better since there is some open space where the corner of the Borg box is touching the stock manifold.
lalessi1, aka Lynn, has an FE with FPA headers & does have decent clearance to the Borgenson box.
This short thread covers it.
http://57fordsforever.com/smf/index.php?topic=7501.msg63896#msg63896
After rereading one of his posts there I think I'll try his method of moving the engine over with a 1/2" thick spacer between the block & motor mount.
And, yeah, please post your pix.

[Ford Blue blood]

quote Bill:"It is by about 3/8".............was that in reply to Tom's statement that it is larger, or mine saying I thought it was smaller?

The 3/8 was/is the distance from the frame to the outside of the Borgeson box.  In other words more clearance.  Given the tight quarters involved with the FE and the huge number of different exhaust manifolds for the FE any given installation will be different and should not be construed as the "end of the story".

Example, the 57 Ranch wagon I had had a 360 from a 74 truck.  Absolutely no clearance issues at all.  The photo doesn't show the clearance real well because the angle is off but there was a good "fat finger" room between the two.  58 Fords and Edsels had FEs in them all day long with no fitment issues.  Bottom line.....it just depends....

[lalessi1]

I know I have more room between my Borgeson and the FPA headers than I had with a '58 box. My '58 box didn't hit the stock FE exhaust manifold. I guess the Borgeson can interfere because of the overall shape???

[Tom S]

58 Fords and Edsels had FEs in them all day long with no fitment issues.  Bottom line.....it just depends....

We know that the '58s with FEs worked fine with the stock steering boxes. Your pic shows a stock steering box.
A member here with only 7 posts, '1958ford', had the same zero clearance to stock exhaust manifold problem when installing a Borg box in his '58 with an FE. Don't know what he did but in his next couple, & last, posts he was looking for headers.
Would be a lot easier to get accurate measurements of how far these different steering boxes protrude into the engine compartment if there wasn't an engine in there. However I'm measuring from above to an inside fender well on two very different cars that have been 'messed with'. No tellin' how well those fender wells are aligned or fitting!
Near as I can tell from that is that the Borg box only protrudes about 5/16" more than a '58 box at its widest point.

[lalessi1]

Tom, just a thought... I have seen on this forum that stock Y block motor mounts should be turned around when used on an FE. I used mine in the stock direction???

[Ford Blue blood]

Found the dimensions for the Borgeson box.  While this box it the one used on midsized Fords (Must, Fairlane, etc.) it is the exact same box as the one used for 52 - 62 full size Fords.  The flange is the exact same thickness for both kits so the measurements from this one will translate directly to the box used on the 57/58s.

[lalessi1]

I have stock 57 and 58 boxes off the frame I can measure... I will do it tomorrow.

[Tom S]

Tom, just a thought... I have seen on this forum that stock Y block motor mounts should be turned around when used on an FE. I used mine in the stock direction???

My mounts are in the same way as yours. It wouldn't change the clearance to the steering box in any case.

... I looked at the mounts when I got them and it appeared to me that they wouldn't move the engine forward or backward very much. ...

Likewise.  I bought some mounts before buying this car since I planned to swap a 390 into the '58.

... the metal face to the front and the open part to the rear. That puts the left valve cover about 1/2"-3/4" from the firewall and the fan about 1" from the radiator. ...

Same here.  Base of left valve cover about 3/4" from the firewall.
But there is no room for a fan spacer as is shown in your pic here in the post I got those quotes from.
http://57fordsforever.com/smf/index.php?topic=5360.msg41391#msg41391
This seems strange since our engines seem to be in the same position fore & aft.  I may be mistaken but I don't think Ford ever made different length water pumps for FEs.  Are our radiators mounted differently?  I believe my stock radiator is in the original position.

It will be interesting to compare your stock box's dimensions to what Bill gave us for the Borgeson.

390, no fan spacer.

[RICH MUISE]

An oem radiator for the six cylinder would have been mounted forward of the 8 cylinder radiator. I think by 1 1/2 or so, but that's just a guess. Moving the 8 cyl radiator forward an inch or so is a simple process, particularly if the car doesn't have the hood installed.
All of the core supports are the same, it's a matter of the flanges on the 6 vs the 8 radiators that place them differently.